Latest KT Tools Prototype - Cutting Gauge

[condeesteso]

I have to say I am excited to see the feedback on this piece, having got my hands on No2 only this afternoon. No point me posting pics as Jim's are better than mine anyway. Couple of things... and I didn't really know 'til I tried it, it was a guess. It is quite 'massy' but not awkwardly heavy. I do not feel the lock screw needs any knurling at all, it clamps up tight enough with the plain knob (noting the clearance between shaft and head is more or less nil, i.e. just enough to move smoothly). The wedge is correct I think (certainly when looking at older versions) - it seems illogical but the hole is tapered, and the sneck needs to be visible to a tool to remove it - not so if it was turned 90 degrees. Re balance, really good to hold and work. I do not think a longer stem helps (personally) and offers capacity most will never use. Re knurling I would visually like the axial (RichardT) approach, but it isn't actually needed. Anyway, Jim will probably do variants... I just went for what I liked.
Small user point - the cylindrical shaft makes it really easy to tilt, start the mark, see the tip into and out of stock etc. Not so with the standard square-ish versions.
Main thing is it certainly works, and very well indeed. Looks OK too.
And for the doubters I am paying proper money for this. I offered £80 (proper money down my way) and that is probably discounted as I sort of helped tweaking it. I am sure it is worth a Glenn Drake plus a handmade premium... but that is for the maker to decide.
May try some pics in use (will need a helper) soon... but keep an eye on this. I think it's right at the front of the new 'shed-maker' excellence emerging in the UK (thank goodness).

 

[jimi43]

Thanks for the kind feedback guys and gals...I am humbled...

Douglas has received his one this afternoon and will be doing a mini review so I will leave pricing and bespoke production until after this testing. I have quite a few price requests and reservation requests today so will let you all know when these trials have been done.

Now to hopefully answer some of your questions...

Regarding the wedge...I just like the design...it is one of the quirkier historical designs.....here is a chunkier one.....

Vann my friend...the socket for the cutter and wedge is tapered on three sides which forces the cutter against the inner edge which is cut straight. It is quite a clever design but I am sure someone here has more details...I'm willing to bet ALF is an expert on this subject!

Alternative methods of holding the cutter...

I find that screws on the end get in the way of my holding the tool...I tend to hold both ends when sliding but that's just me. Putting in a recessed screw as in later designs is ok but I don't find it as positive as a wedge and after all...how often to you adjust this aspect of the tool once set?

Raw material costs Rod....

The cost of high quality material is a small proportion of the overall production cost.....labour is very much the majority of the cost. I use high quality brass...I might use gunmetal too...but cheap brass is horrible so I don't intend lowering quality that way. Yes...I guess this is more of a top end tool...but all my designs will be...I think there is a market. As far as weight...I will leave Douglas to comment....

Regarding knurling...I will be able to do cross hatch, axial or none at all. I have tried the lathe method Richard...it works well but I think I will prefer to do pressure knurling. Douglas thinks the plain look works...and it is fine to lock the shaft/face.

Derek...the physical size can be dimensioned to various hand sizes, tastes....again Douglas liked the larger head....I prefer the slightly smaller one... For production...we will probably settle on a happy medium or make two types....and yes...Jarrah is very much on the cards!

Pvt-Ryan....regarding the polishing or not decision...I tend to make brushed surfaces for those which will rub and polished for those that won't. I like contrast in brass...hence the polished surfaces of the rim and inner bevels of the knob. I think this is very attractive. BB is spot on here with his explanation.

As I said at the start...this is very much WIP...and a prototype...another trial for possible inclusion in the range that I will settle on when I finally get into production.....

Bespoke tools will always be available and I have discussed prices with a few others so that will be decided soon.

Thanks again folks for all the feedback...and I've just noticed that Douglas has posted some more comments on initial impressions...so I will await the full review before moving further...but I somehow think this one is definitely up there as a prime candidate for production.

Cheers!

Jim

 

[No skills]

Jim, they are superb!

The serious wood worker can certainly build up an amazing tool kit with some of the low volume/high quality hand made tools I have seen on here of late.

Have you considered doing a gauge with a roller? or are you set on the pin/blade type?

 

[Beardo16]

All im going to say is nice job, maybe once production has started i would love to know a final cost.

Again very nice indeed

Adam

 

[MickCheese]

Jim

Fantastic job and definitely a 'work of art', funny you should post this today as I was only this morning using the mallet you made me and thinking how absolutely lovely it was, so perfectly balanced. This gauge really is a high end tool.

Bridge City Tools move over!

Mick

 

[rileytoolworks]

Lovely work Jimi. I've been working on a prototype marking gauge myself these last few weeks. (using stainless and blackwood)
I love the timber choice of yours though.
Can I ask what size the stock is? What lathe have you got, by the way?
Good luck mate.
Adam.

 

[jimi43]

Thanks for the feedback Douglas...most kind of you! I felt in a shadow today with the bench and Pedder's gent's saw though! We did have quite a bit to try out that's for sure!

I look forward to seeing the results of your further testing....I should have made it before you made your beautiful bench...then it would have seen some workout!!!

No Skills....funny you should mention the roller cutter design...Douglas gave me one today to take away and study...I have some ideas for this design for those that like them...blended with a beautiful antique design I have been studying lately....watch this space!

Mick....that is most coincidental and so glad you are pleased with your mallet. Douglas was showing me the paces he put his mallet through today...boy..he wasn't joking when he said he put it through some gruesome workout! Don't worry about having to be gentle...the lignum vitae really takes some punishment...trust me on that one! Not that you use it for mortices but it's nice to know it will stand up to it when you do...! :wink:

Adam...how are you my friend? Please post some pictures of your gauge...that sounds gorgeous! Strangely...when I was finishing off Douglas' one...I was pondering about variants....stainless and ebony was one thought that whizzed through my mind...I would love to see how that looks if you can spare a moment to share.

Again...thanks for the feedback my friends!

Jim

 

[bugbear]

Alternative methods of holding the cutter...

I find that screws on the end get in the way of my holding the tool...I tend to hold both ends when sliding but that's just me. Putting in a recessed screw as in later designs is ok but I don't find it as positive as a wedge and after all...how often to you adjust this aspect of the tool once set?

That's a countersunk woodscrew, with a thread tapped onto the shank, which engages a female thread in the brass slug, visible above the cutter. I used a BSW thread, since it's easy to source. The blade has never moved in use, but if you wanted a more "positive" hold, you could hunt down a BSF, BSC or BA bolt.

Of course, the metal-lathe advantaged could more easily create a purpose made bolt.

BugBear

 

[rileytoolworks]

Hi Jimi. You asked for photos, well these are the early prototype prototype!
Obviously this has not got it's cutter or adjusting screw, but you get the idea.
These will have a hardened silver steel wheel type cutter (made by me), and stainless shaft. The shaft is a sliding fit on the stock.
This one is in stainless, bronze and wenge. This was a practice piece for the real thing, which will not feature the bronze detail.
Forgive the picture quality, and the fact it looks 'unfinished' (which, of course, it is!)






I hope to be finished prototyping in the next week or so, but I've got the machines set up for another paying job at the moment.
(Sorry for hijacking the thread Jimi)
Thanks.
Adam.

 

[jimi43]

No hijack at all Adam...a request!!

Wonderful mate...I really like that design.

Funnily enough...we are working in the same direction on the same design...for the wheel type but I think that mine will be more vintage looking...there is something with the smaller wheel gauges...Douglas and I discussed them...but I want to make them work slightly differently...

Will show and tell later but meanwhile keep the pictures coming mate...this is a really interesting tool.

Jim

 

[jimi43]

BB...that's the design I was mulling over....believe me, I thought long and hard about this option...but I love the wedge and I think that was why I incorporated it more than functionality...just the look. I have a soft spot for wedged infills too...I guess that it's a visual thing.

Thanks for showing your example.....nicely made mate!

Jimi

 

[Harbo]

I think MrEd made some of those designs a few years ago?
Based on the Tite-Mark, Veritas types.

Rod

 

[bugbear]

BB...that's the design I was mulling over....believe me, I thought long and hard about this option...but I love the wedge and I think that was why I incorporated it more than functionality...just the look. I have a soft spot for wedged infills too...I guess that it's a visual thing.

Thanks for showing your example.....nicely made mate!

Jimi

You also said that screws get in the way, and that a wedge is more secure. I addressed both those points specifically.

If your preference is aesthetic or historic, that's a different matter, but that's not what you said.

BugBear

 

[jimi43]

BB...that's the design I was mulling over....believe me, I thought long and hard about this option...but I love the wedge and I think that was why I incorporated it more than functionality...just the look. I have a soft spot for wedged infills too...I guess that it's a visual thing.

Thanks for showing your example.....nicely made mate!

Jimi

You also said that screws get in the way, and that a wedge is more secure. I addressed both those points specifically.

If your preference is aesthetic or historic, that's a different matter, but that's not what you said.

BugBear

Yes sorry BB....the screw is easier to remove the cutter...and it is my opinion that the wedge is no less positive and the over-riding decision to go with it was aesthetics and historical preference. I believe there are many design elements that have passed into obscurity or disuse and shouldn't have....I want to make my tools with this consideration for the past.

In trials, Douglas found some interesting benefits to the wedge which had nothing to do with its main purpose....but I'll leave him to explain those...I'm sure he'll be along later to comment.

Cheers mate

Jim

 

[jimi43]

Oh...and Adam...the wood lathe I use is a turn of last century Taylor of Hulme metal lathe which has lost accuracy for metal work but has more than enough mass for woodworking...no speed control..converted from belt to pulley and my little baby...

The metal lathe is just as bonkers...and old original ML1 with a few tweaks ....

I suppose one day I will grow up and get proper equipment but for now...these little ladies will have to do! :mrgreen:

Stock shaft is 5/8" bar stock from my favourite FleaBay metal supplier, O1 stock is from a lovely lady in Maidstone.

I have some 1/2" round bar too...I think that will be used next to make different versions of another head design I am tinkering with...more on that later! :wink:

Jimi

 

[bugbear]

The metal lathe is just as bonkers...and old original ML1 with a few tweaks ....

I think metal workers always modify their lathes - because they can!

BugBear

 

[jimi43]

Indeed BB! :mrgreen:

I needed to modify this one though...it came from FleaBay for £100 and there were a number of bits missing...like the countershaft...the motor....parts of the cross-slide and the toolpost.

So needs must in this case...one day I will get around to putting guards on them!

Jim

 

[bugbear]

Indeed BB! :mrgreen:

I needed to modify this one though...it came from FleaBay for £100 and there were a number of bits missing...like the countershaft...the motor....parts of the cross-slide and the toolpost.

So needs must in this case...one day I will get around to putting guards on them!

Jim

I'd call that replacement, not modification. Sounds like fun!

I read in an old model engineer of a guy adding screw cutting facilities to a Super Adept...

BugBear

 

[condeesteso]

turned into a bloody lathe thread now... I'm off :lol:
(yes, a pun, I know).

 

[jumps]

turned into a bloody lathe thread now... I'm off :lol:
(yes, a pun, I know).

ah - but it attracted others...........

Jimi - simply stunning (again), and I think you have nailed the combination of precision/built to last with a retro look. =D>

One question; given the precision inherent in the design, why wouldn't you inscibe the stock in mm to make it even quicker to set, say, 38mm?

I'm guessing that it might relate to the time/cost equation for individually crafted tools like this, but thought I would ask