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How would you rate the UK's handling of this pandemic?

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Rorschach

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???

I just thought it was a good comment.
I thought it was a bit of a snide comment, my apologies if that was not the intention. As I said, I agree that is a good comment for deniers (they do exist and they are rather mad).
 

Selwyn

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I don't think Rocshach and Selwyn are deniers, reading their posts, they are saying there may have been an alternative way.
The issue is not black and white, deniers and believers. To catagorise posters as this is wrong, I think there is a central position and some are one way or the other, more or less lock down / restrictions.
The "denier" thing is always levelled at people who say "hold on maybe shutting down the world isn't a good thing". Its a bit like its got connotations with holocaust denial and we must be right wing heartless sprouts who want everyone to die.

But the thing is its pathetic. Lockdown is no bother for a lot of pensioners and the public sector (pockets of medical staff excluded) but its devastating for a lot of others who prop up this sector
 

Rorschach

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What the hell does Roger Daltrey know about pandemics?
You better you better you bet he knows a lot more than you think. oooh ooooh!
He could see it coming for miles and miles and miles away.
 

RobinBHM

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There is a very good reason that thousands of people every year risk their lives (and many die in the process) trying to reach the UK having passed through plenty of safe, comfortable countries and some people want us to turn into the kinds of places they are escaping from
A most insightful comment.

It's utterly disgusting the way this government puts measures in place to stop the public from catching a nasty virus.
 

Rorschach

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£500 incentive to go and catch it now!

Hmm now where is the best place to go and find someone to cough on me?
 

Rorschach

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I notice no-one dared make a comment on my question about death figures.

Just heard on the radio Professor Anthony Brookes say that once death figures come down to a level that we would normally see in a "normal" flu year we should go back to complete normality. I can't see the BBC allowing that one!
 

Amateur

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Its no good getting upset.
The situation IMO is being handled not in an individual country level, but globally.
To understand this you need to look at every country.
Each one using the exact same format, which indicates that the strategy was worked out long before the pandemic hit.
There are wider implications too.
Our reliance on other countries for imports has shown just how vulnerable we have become during the pandemic when the supply chain has just been halted.
Ask any tradesman how it's affecting him.
It's not just tradesmen its shortages in everything that's preventing people going about their normal working day even if they were allowed to
My hope is that eventually the importance of not having to totally rely on China for instance, will sink in to our politicians brains?
Some manufacturing should be brought back and this Power House of the North that's being talked about will become reality..
I can see problems with the climate folk now. Our carbon footprint. The return of smog and dirt. While they are quite happy to accept goods from countries breaking the rules they themselves fought for and turning a blind eye to poor working conditions, very little wages and inhuman treatment.

Said he with so many Chinese tools in his collection.!

If this pandemic has shown up one major flaw its that a Global unified world doesn't work in practice.
At the end of the day, when the penny drops and things Get really tough, it's about looking after ourselves.
 

Vann

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...It was government intervention that stopped Covid in NZ...
That's correct. Our PM announced that covid was serious, that we needed to take drastic and immediate action to try to limit it.
We have had 5 deaths per million of population.
In the USA it was described as just a flu, nothing to worry about. They have 1,239 (and climbing) per million.
In Britain Boris wrung his hands, apparently worried about economic impact, and hoping for herd immunity - and you have 1,396 deaths per million.

the evidence pretty much points towards: "the harder and earlier you lockdown, the much lower the community spread and the faster you recover"...
That's correct. Here in New Zealand, with the exception of international tourism and international students, the economy is doing better than all predictions. Life is almost back to normal.

...The UK has chosen pretty lax lockdowns...
I agree. I think I heard on the radio today that UK will be inforcing the breakup of gatherings of more than 15 people. What's the point? If 1 of those 15 is infected, then a further 14 carriers take it to 15 other gatherings - that's 225 people potentially infected in just one degree of separation. I hope I've got the details wrong and it's much stricter than that.

...They will have more covid deaths in due course, vaccine or not
You are probably correct. To an extent we've been lucky. Australia was doing better than us at just over 4 deaths per million - but then it got away on them in Melbourne and it climbed to 35.6 deaths per million before they got it back under control. But that's still a HELL of a lot better than the result in countries that put economics first (and are suffering the economic impact of procrastinated partial shutdowns)

Yes this is true

Decisive harder faster lockdowns would've resulted in lower deaths.
Yes, and less economic hardship.

...We should not assume our personal balance of life vs economy vs personal freedoms is absolute, but that a range of opinions is justified...
The arguement about personal freedoms is bol-locks (and I'm not suggesting you're promoting it). There are lots of things we have to restrict in order to protect other members of society - driving only on the correct side of the road is a simplistic example. Locking down to protect yourself and others as a temporary measure is just sensible. Long term measures need to be more thoroughly debated in democratic societies like ours and yours.

But I agree, there are countries where governments might take advantage of lockdowns to erode personal freedoms. But the UK and NZ are not included in that list. There are also people who are paranoid...

My tuppence worth.

Cheers, Vann.
 

D_W

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No they didn't.

Are you a pensioner or in a comfortable financial position by the way?
Pensioners and folks with state jobs were the loudest about shutting down here, too, as they thought they had protected income. The pensioners do. The state and local gov workers found out the hard way that they could be furloughed.

Now, the teachers union will be at odds with the new president, who wants all of the schools reopened. That'll be interesting. The teachers unions here generally will take whatever they can get regardless of reality. If they can have 3.5 hours of teleteaching a day instead of 7 on site, they'll fight tooth and nail to keep that far longer than needed. But they leave their support staff out of their contracts, and those folks are unemployed.
 

Selwyn

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That's correct. Our PM announced that covid was serious, that we needed to take drastic and immediate action to try to limit it.
We have had 5 deaths per million of population.
In the USA it was described as just a flu, nothing to worry about. They have 1,239 (and climbing) per million.
In Britain Boris wrung his hands, apparently worried about economic impact, and hoping for herd immunity - and you have 1,396 deaths per million.


That's correct. Here in New Zealand, with the exception of international tourism and international students, the economy is doing better than all predictions. Life is almost back to normal.


I agree. I think I heard on the radio today that UK will be inforcing the breakup of gatherings of more than 15 people. What's the point? If 1 of those 15 is infected, then a further 14 carriers take it to 15 other gatherings - that's 225 people potentially infected in just one degree of separation. I hope I've got the details wrong and it's much stricter than that.


You are probably correct. To an extent we've been lucky. Australia was doing better than us at just over 4 deaths per million - but then it got away on them in Melbourne and it climbed to 35.6 deaths per million before they got it back under control. But that's still a HELL of a lot better than the result in countries that put economics first (and are suffering the economic impact of procrastinated partial shutdowns)


Yes, and less economic hardship.


The arguement about personal freedoms is bol-locks (and I'm not suggesting you're promoting it). There are lots of things we have to restrict in order to protect other members of society - driving only on the correct side of the road is a simplistic example. Locking down to protect yourself and others as a temporary measure is just sensible. Long term measures need to be more thoroughly debated in democratic societies like ours and yours.

But I agree, there are countries where governments might take advantage of lockdowns to erode personal freedoms. But the UK and NZ are not included in that list. There are also people who are paranoid...

My tuppence worth.

Cheers, Vann.
You would think listening to the media that outside the obvious first wave (care home mess up included) that we are experiencing unprecedented levels of mortality. We are not. And this is why fanatics like Retired Robin wants even stricter lockdown fanaticism but has no thought for those who will have to pay him out
 

Selwyn

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Pensioners and folks with state jobs were the loudest about shutting down here, too, as they thought they had protected income. The pensioners do. The state and local gov workers found out the hard way that they could be furloughed.

Now, the teachers union will be at odds with the new president, who wants all of the schools reopened. That'll be interesting. The teachers unions here generally will take whatever they can get regardless of reality. If they can have 3.5 hours of teleteaching a day instead of 7 on site, they'll fight tooth and nail to keep that far longer than needed. But they leave their support staff out of their contracts, and those folks are unemployed.
I do have sympathy with teachers. They could be vaccinated asap but we won't do it because of need to retain the lockdown narrative for a while yet
 
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