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GEPPETTO

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Hi All,

I'm asking you if anyone has the house heating with "heat pump" and "radiant floor". If it's. What does he think about?

I'm asking that because a I have radiant floor and a Condensing LPG gas boiler which costs too much to use.
 

RogerS

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Hi Gabriele

I'm in a similar position to you, I think, in that I do not have mains gas. We use oil (as LPG in the UK is generally reckoned to be the most expensive fuel IIRC). I have an old boiler and did consider fitting a condensing boiler since these are the most efficient. I had a sense that my old boilers efficiency was in the low 60% - as opposed to 90-95% ?? for a condensing one.

I calculated/estimated the fuel saving and then compared that against how much it would cost me to put in a new boiler. I even tried to estimate what the price of oil might go up to over the foreseeable future. Even allowing for quite draconian price rises, it would still have taken about 10 years to break even and we weren't sure that we'd be here that long.

Then I got the boiler serviced and discovered that my efficiency was already well over 80% and so the time to break even suddenly disappeared out of the window and I abandoned that idea.

You, on the other hand, already HAVE the most efficient type of boiler and so you're not going to make any savings there.

You say 'radiant floor' by which I guess you mean underfloor heating with the central heating hot water running through pipes? It all comes down to insulation under your floor as there is no point in heating the earth...but...a BIG BUT...you can only realistically do that before you put in the radiant floor. So I think that you are basically stuffed.

I don't know whether underfloor heating would be more/less efficient than radiators. Guess it will depend on the underfloor insulation.

I also looked into heat pumps and also geothermal heating systems. At one time you could get a grant from the UK Govt towards the cost of this but even then the payback time was so.o.o.o long that it wasn't cost effective. For clarification heat pumps AFAIK refer to a large area of piping located just beneath soil level and you extract the suns radiant energy from the ground. Retrofitting to an existing system was complex and expensive. Geothermal...you dig down deep and tap the earths heat...again with a heat exchanger...and again retrofitting is complex.

Then you have to ADD IN the cost of the electricity to run the heat exchanger.

Sorry to be not more optimistic but the only real answer is insulation, insulation, insulation. But in an old house with old windows and gaps in the floorboards that is not easy to do without destroying the character of the house. Ours is old and draughty but we wouldn't swop it.

Maybe you missed the sign above the door when you bought the house

Lasciate ogni speranza, voi ch'entrate...if I am quoting my Dante correctly :lol:
 

GEPPETTO

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Hi Roger,Waterhead37

Yes I have the underfloor heating system with the central heating hot water running through pipes.
The entire system has been insulated by the underneath with polyurethane panels. The roof was insulated with 10 cm of cork and it has been made ventilated.Walls are made with Poroton bricks which have insulating proprieties. Therefore I think insulation is OK :? A part these jobs the cost af LPG is huge (100€ every week) :shock: . I don't want to think what I could pay in traditional system . :shock:
In these days I'm thinking about thermic solar and geothermal heat pump but I don' t know.They are so expensive. On the web I found that the payback time with the second way is about 4/5 years :-k .

I could burn wood waste from my woodworking :idea: but unfortunately it's much time I don't build something :roll:
:wink:

P.S. How someone could have understood, I didn't build my house only by myself 8) . In sense that I had a contract with some bricklayers which brought the house to the point I could do the rest by myself.
They made foundations,walls,roof and wall coats (I don't know how it's said). After plumber and carpenter( :oops: ) done theirs job. After this I made electric system,floor,walls covering and some other things I was able to make.
 

trevtheturner

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Hi Gabriele,

In general terms here in the UK, undertaking your project as you did, even with contracted help from professional builders, we consider that 'you built your house' - and an impressive job you have achieved, too!

Regarding heating, I use domestic heating oil. My house is old, not paticularly well insulated, and a bit larger than average. Although the cost of oil, like everything else, is ever increasing here, it will cost me less than 1000 euros for (radiators) central heating this winter (November to April inclusive). This is about the best I think I can achieve - certainly better than :shock: 100 euros per week.

I don't know about the cost of heating oil in Italy but wonder whether a conversion to oil heating (new boiler, storage tank, etc.) might be worth considering in the long term. And you could, of course, supplement your existing system with one or two room radiators if you felt that necessary.

Cheers,

Trev.
 

GEPPETTO

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trevtheturner":44ibztno said:
Hi Gabriele,

In general terms here in the UK, undertaking your project as you did, even with contracted help from professional builders, we consider that 'you built your house' - and an impressive job you have achieved, too!

Regarding heating, I use domestic heating oil. My house is old, not paticularly well insulated, and larger than average. Although the cost of oil, like everything else, is ever increasing here, it will cost me less than 1000 euros for (radiators) central heating this winter (November to April inclusive). This is about the best I think I can achieve - certainly better than :shock: 100 euros per week.

I don't know about the cost of heating oil in Italy but wonder whether a conversion to oil heating (new boiler, storage tank, etc.) might be worth considering in the long term. And you could, of course, supplement your existing system with one or two room radiators if you felt that necessary.

Cheers,

Trev.
Hi trev,

when you sai "oil" what do you mean: Diesel oil or general oil? Long time ago my father (mmmhh at that time my family : i lived with they) had oil heating. But It was general oil, one rough result of pretoleum. It was very pollutant. Now he has methane gas.
About your last sentence, the problem isn't I can't warm myself. I can it. The problem is: I pay too much ( think). Ok, I could convert to diesel but I don't think that will be all that gain: I could gain only (by information of Il portale del Sole): € 2.358,00-€ 2.192,00=€ 167.

I think even because all we live on the same boat (earth), why don't try to make it floating for long time. Let's try to think with other mentality. The mentality of man who don't only think at the money. I know. It's very difficult.We live in this Society.
It's also true, my re-thinking about house heating it has come because I paid too much but I want to think this is even because my latest thinking way. The heat pump or solar choise could be an example.

But now I must to come down from pedestal. :oops:

Excuse me please if I I am appeared a little "teacher", it was not my intention but it is quite my new thinking way.

If we will not meet again (before new year becomes) I wish you have a Gooooooood Neeeeeeeew Yeaaaaaaar.
 

PowerTool

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Heating oil -

Almost all UK domestic central heating systems use 28sec oil, which is sometimes known as kerosene. This fuel burns more cleanly than heavier oil products such as gasoil, which is also known as 35sec heating oil. 28sec oil can also be used in kitchen ranges such as AGA cookers.

As the sulphur content of oil has fallen, some domestic oil suppliers have added additional lubricants to kerosene to enable fuel to be pumped to the boiler more easily. This is not usually necessary for most systems, as modern pumps have been engineered to operate effectively with low-sulphur fuels, but if you are unsure if you would benefit from using such fuels, speak to your equipment supplier.
The name comes from the viscosity (thickness) of the oil,as measured on the Saybolt Universal Viscometer -

Saybolt Universal Seconds (SUS) is a dated unit of measure of viscosity. The time in Saybolt Universal Seconds (SUS) required for 60 milliliters of a petroleum product to flow through the calibrated orifice of a Saybolt Universal viscometer. Sometimes referred to as the SSU number (Seconds Saybolt Universal) or SSF number (Saybolt Seconds Furol).
So the higher the number,the thicker the liquid

Andrew (who learnt of such things at agricultural college :D )
 
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