I take it you didn’t actually watch the video before dismissing it, this was covered at 1:44 in.Jacob":2qup44rx said:I'd be more impressed if someone did a video of somebody using two push sticks. Tiny fraction of the price of Saw stop but much, much, safer and will work on ALL the machines in your workshop un modified; TS, Spindle, Planer, router table.
Two push sticks about £5 or make your own from scraps.
Saw stop will never become standard as it is incredibly expensive and there are of years of use left in so many older machines. The alternative? Obviously to introduce push sticks more thoroughly.Trevanion":1gn76vk9 said:.
Of course, push sticks work for a fraction of the price, can't really argue with that. The only problem is even after 200 years of working with circular saws and the numerous examples of accidents involving saws (Everyone knows someone who's had a run-in :roll, workmen still don't tend to use them because of the "It won't happen to me" ego that you don't lose until you're in your 70's. The alternative? Introduce a passive safety feature that will eventually be the standard on all new saws.
They said that about pretty much every safety feature on a car, The push stick VS Sawstop/PCS argument is sort of like "Why do you need airbags when you could just drive tidier?" Because there's always going to be that one silly person that doesn't drive tidy and the airbag is going to make the difference where either his head gets smashed into a pulp on the steering wheel or that he has a chance of surviving. It won't be standard immediately, no. Eventually, they will become more common and cheaper with time, secondhand machines will be passed down to the people that can afford them, etc and eventually (I'm talking 20+ years here), I can see it becoming a part of the woodworking regulations because it just makes sense. It's exactly the same as machine brakes, limiter tooling and even safety bumpers on the end of a nailgun, in the hands of a safe, experienced operator who is fully aware of what their doing it would be fine to use machinery that takes 5 minutes to run-down or spindle moulder cutters that have a potential to take off 10mm in a single pass or nailguns with no safety features, it's the unsafe, complacent "Won't happen to me" workers that make up 95% or so of the countries workforce that usually gets injured.Jacob":356u6zh0 said:Saw stop will never become standard as it is incredibly expensive and there are of years of use left in so many older machines.
I quite like a spiked stick myself, very handy around the TS for moving offcuts near the blade .Jacob":356u6zh0 said:What disturbs me is that people will talk about Saw stop but tend to be blind or even negative about push sticks.
This is something I've been pondering for a very long time (Gotta do something in those hours of power-feeding :lol as it's pretty much the next logical step. Making it work for a moulder would be tricky, you can't have the shaft shoot downwards as it can be cutting above a workpiece or put into a false fence so it would just bind on those, you can't have the fence shoot forward away from the cutters as the operator would get a gut-full of launched workpiece :lol:. The only way I could see it working is if the shaft assembly was on an independent back and forth slider which only operated when the safety feature was activated, the slider would shoot back taking the shaft and moulder block with it. This should work in theory with any standard set-up I can think of, even with the shaft tilted. The only thing I don't think it would work with is curved work, but I think curved work is perhaps one of the least dangerous (While being the most dangerous) aspects of spindle moulding as in you don't really get complacent about it, you're always focused on the work because it is dangerous.Inspector":1zm1vd6q said:I can see them adapting it to shapers someday.
It did occur to me that if you had the expensive saw stop system the the obvious way to avoid firing it would be to get to grips with push sticks.Inspector":1jv4iaio said:What about me Jacob? I have a SawStop and use push sticks too.......
Well remote doesn't mean impossible so I'll keep using it.Jacob":3sqzrs4a said:........the risk of an accidental cut has become extremely remote ..........
accidentally triggering the saw stop (damp wood etc) still remains......
Kind of does, out of 165,100 casualties only 1,770 died. You take airbags out of the equation and the number of deaths would easily include that 25,000 seriously injured band if not more.Jacob":29mt9r56 said:Parallels with vehicle air bags don't really work:
1,770 reported road deaths.
26,610 people killed or seriously injured.
165,100 casualties of all severities
Yojevol":1buhirtv said:The market that Felder are aiming at with these saws is very much upper end commercial companies. In these days of litigation such a company may well take the view that it makes economic sense to shell out the extra capital cost so that, in the event of an accident, they will have seen to have done everything possible to minimise the risk.
At the moment PCS is only available for our kappa 550. In the future, this system should also be available for our Hammer machines but it needs to optimized, also in terms of its costs, before this step can be taken.