False (suspended?) ceiling...

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goldeneyedmonkey

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Hello all,

I'm planning on installing a false ceiling in my workshop-to-be, to eliminate some of the racket that I'm making. I have some vibration mounts that I'm going to fix to the top-side of some MDF, and then have loft-type insulation sat on top of it, providing an air-gap above it of about 20mm or so.

The insulation will be between 100mm and 150mm, haven't decided yet, my question is, are there some brackets that I could get to attach the vibration mounts to the joists in the ceiling above? Otherwise I'm thinking of using some of this stainless steel banding. Anyone got any ideas if this wold work?

It's not going to be a massive load, 9-12mm MDF and then probably 100mm insulation on top. There will be a vibration mount fixing every 2m square or so. Depending on the joists. These are the mounts I'm talking about.

Has anyone got any better ideas on how to do this? All I want is a suspended ceiling utilising these vibration mounts I have. Cheap as possible.

Input much appreciated and needed.

Cheers all _Dan.
 
there is a possibility that using those are an overkill to be honest, as most of the vibration/noise will be taken out with the insulation. The problem regarding the vibration it will travel through the walls themselves. As they say a chain is only as strong as its weakest link.
 
The party wall will have a stud wall filled with insulation, air-gap behind and 2 layes of plasterboard on to make it as dense as possible as cheaply as possible.
The garage door is going to have overlapping layers of carpet (at least 3) and then some more insulation over that. All this will be removable, I've worked it out in my head but not yet implemented it, should be interesting :D.

The ground floor of mine and next doors house is garage, then the living room sits on top of it. The joints run across into next doors house I think. (Not found them yet, but the sound carrying through from their garage would suggest so).

Cheers _Dan
 
The sound will also travel though any strapping,banding or bolts used to suspend the ceiling.
Acoustic isolation is achieved with a mixture of absorption (fibreglass) and high mass which is difficult to achieve with a ceiling.

Bob
 
if you like i can talk you through it, I used to project manage cinema fit outs where the acoustics were of paramount importance in the auditoriums.
 
Interesting thread Dan. I live in a detached house, but noise escaping through the 'shop (garage) door was something I worked on to reduce draughts, but mainly to reduce noise leakage to outside.

I blocked the door in with a couple of old quilts stapled round the frame, some 50mm polystyrene sheets and then a couple of 18mm MDF boards (so that I can screw tools to it). But the carpet idea sounds better - thinner, but I bet it offers more sound/draught defence than quilts/polystyrene.

Cheers

Karl
 
Thanks for all the input folks, definitely helping the thought process. Though visualising all the different options is frying my brain a bit :D.

Thanks for the link Mike, I'll go to them if I can't utilise stuff from my local merchants.

Bob, I realised that any connection to the joists above will transmit the vibrations, but I've decided the best I can do is probably use these vibration mounts that I have and thread some inserts into battens attached to the joists. Then do the same on the other end of the mount and screw MDF onto the lower batten from the underside. All joints filled with decorators caulk so that the MDF can be primed and painted afterwards.

Thanks for the offer Mark, I may yet take you up on that, but I'll see how it goes for now.

Karl, I'm ony using this carpet as it was the old stuff that was ripped out of here when I decorated. Although if I didn't have that I was going to use underlay anyway. Any leftover insulation from the ceiling and wall will be put into a material sack (for want of a bettter word) and put up against the garage door, held there by magnets.
I'm planing on having a strip of carpet attached to all the walls around the garage door about 3-4" wide, then the next full door size layer will overlap this and so on, building up the layers till I run out.
The garage is about 1 1/2 - 2 times the size at the back compared to the front where the door is, so it's not eating into the useable space, merely filling the alcove. All this will also do wonders (hopefully :D) to the heat insulation come winter time.

Thanks again all, and I feel I should probably document what I end up doing so you can all have a giggle :)

Cheers _Dan.
 
speak to the local dry lining supplier, you can get all you need there for the soundproofing. the mounts you linked to are no good. accoustic board and metal top hat suspended off the above subfloor with the coorect materials will do what you need.
 
Cheers Mike, I had looked at resilient bar before, but thought these mounts might be the best way to go. I'll research it a bit further, not sure the local merchants have these, think I've asked before but I'll doube check.

Ta. _Dan
 
mike71":24adgg4n said:
speak to the local dry lining supplier, you can get all you need there for the soundproofing. the mounts you linked to are no good. accoustic board and metal top hat suspended off the above subfloor with the correct materials will do what you need.

what i would use

15mm soundbloc board (its blue and heavy)
mastic all joints with acoustic seal
and i would fix this to MF

your best local (they are nationwide) supplier are probably these

CPD
Coronation Road
Ilkeston DE7 5UA
0115 944 1359
 
+ 1 on the gypsum link provided by Mike, any solid surface such as MDF boards, however mounted, will reflect noise not absorb it.

Insulation would work to a reasonable extent but acoustic boards are by far, the better choice. I'm assuming your garage is fireproofed? as it's attached to the house?? you can buy pre finished acoustic panels which are also fireproof, which can be glued directly to the plasterboard ceiling, this will retain the fireproofing - ceiling height - sealed surface - and decoration (if required) reduce the components required and the labour and time required :idea: ...simple (hammer) ...bosshogg
no man is an island
 
Plasterboard is pretty good for sound. Better with a double layer, and rockwool on top.
Are you sure you have a sound problem? Has anybody complained? Have you tried leaving everything switched on with the doors and windows closed and checking the sound from 20 yards away? You might be surprised at how little escapes. High frequencies make the most noise inside the shop, but don't travel as far as you might expect.

The joints run across into next doors house I think.
Extremely unlikely as would be against building regs, unless the houses were really badly built, or converted from something existing. You might have joists into your shared party wall but nothing going through.
 
I'm going to go with low-tech I think, using the mounts that I've already got. (I know it's probably not the best, but resilient bar and full acoustic plasterboard is breaking the budget that I set myself.)

I'm going to build another stud wall @ the back of the 'shop so that I have 2 x stud walls at right angles to each other, these won't be full height. leave about 10-20mm from the ceiling. Then some cheapo home-made brackets (probably out of some 4"x2" that I've got spare) will be placed on every availlable wall so that they leave enough room on top for 2 x layers of plasterboard, with 100mm for rockwool type insulation and a bit of an airgap. In the centre it will be supported by the vibration mounts that I already have.

It won't look the prettiest, but it will be functional. And should provide a decent amount of sound deadening for the dollar spent. Acoustic sealant used around all edges. And decorators caulk used on the joints of the plasterboard.

I know how much the sound carries as our houses are mirror images of each other. I can hear their lad kicking a footy about when he's in there. So they, I think, will have the same level of sound going through. Maybe a bit less as I've dry-lined it and had it skimmed.

I'm not too fussed about the expenditure to an extent, as I'm saving massive amounts on overheads, and this is only a stepping stone until I can justify a bigger workshop through a bigger workload. It'll be a dedicated spray-shop in the future if everything goes to plan. I don't want to spend too much of the cash I have for materials/ float on this right now, but if needs be then I can add another layer of acoustic plasterboard on as well. The bloke next door works till 5, the kids aren't back till 3.45-4. But I'm not sure when the bird works till, I have briefly asked, but she's very vague about it. :?

I'm not going to work past 4 anyway, I'm just trying to keep the peace as best as possible.

Thanks all, this font of knowledge is very useful :D Cheers _Dan.
 
hi Dan
I've built a dubbing theatre in a noisy concrete building.The ceiling was hung on decoupling mounts which had rubber cones inside. try customaudiodesign.co.uk for ideas
Your biggest issue when sealed inside a soundproofed room will be dust exposure - a can of worms in itself
Matt
 
Cheers for the links guys. I've got a half-mask that I wear when machining anything, I can open the up and over door and front door to create a through draft to flush out any leftover dust. Got decent D.E equipment, though no cyclone included in the system as yet (another thing on the list) and a JET Air Filter to run for an hour or so before and after 'shop times. I'm going to work out a way to exhaust the gases outside @ some point. But just getting set-up for now is the M.O.

Thanks for al the help. Cheers _Dan.
 
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