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lurker

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Now we are on the edge of compulsory wearing of face masks in shops etc........

These only have some use by preventing the wearer contaminating others.
They do not protect the wearer indeed a case could be made for them being detrimental to the wearer.
I think most of us either through our hobby or work, know that proper fit and the right mask is essential.

I am getting rather annoyed when I see folks wearing masks with a valve as these are just venting unfiltered air and are totally innapropriate and damn selfish.
 

Rorschach

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Oooh I think we are going to agree on something! lol

You are absolutely bang on, but it's even worse, wearing masks changes the behaviour of the wearer and those around them causing them to act in a more risky manner, same thing happens with gloves.
 

Trainee neophyte

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If you wear a mask, and have the evil disease, your mask is going to be a colossal repository of virus. Watch everyone who wears a mask incessantly pulling and tugging and repositioning their masks, all the time. Watch them not wash their hands every time they touch their mask. Watch them touch their mask and then touch produce, railings, door handles, so on and so forth.

I don't have the data, but I would guess mask wearers touch their faces/masks more often than non wearers touch their faces.

But it keeps Karen happy, so we must all comply.
 

Droogs

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Now that my Readybrek treatment is over and I have been allowed to go beyond my front gate, I will be wearing a mask as it is mandatory up here in the rather less infected north. I will not me wearing a cloth or paper mask at any time, I will wear a proper sealing halfmask with ffp3 filters and pre-filters as my immune system will still take 3 months to regenerate to normal levels. I will wear this as it will afford ME the level of protection I need, the mask is/will be cleaned properly on my return home each time and the pre-filter replaced. I know I am covid free having been in my house since the end of February (apart from treatment visits while wearing said mask) and do not need to filter what I breath out just the in. I
 
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Surely if they're going to make mask wearing compulsory, then there must be some system in place to provide people with suitable masks in the first place?

Else you'll just get people wearing handkerchiefs, or week old painters masks etc which is entirely pointless.

Or .... we'll be right back at the tissue roll thing where people hoard them and sell them for crazy prices.

I have no idea how it should work, but just telling people they have to wear a mask and letting them get on with it seems rather incomplete to me.
 

lurker

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Droogs":3m8k5gej said:
Now that my Readybrek treatment is over and I have been allowed to go beyond my front gate, I will be wearing a mask as it is mandatory up here in the rather less infected north. I will not me wearing a cloth or paper mask at any time, I will wear a proper sealing halfmask with ffp3 filters and pre-filters as my immune system will still take 3 months to regenerate to normal levels. I will wear this as it will afford ME the level of protection I need, the mask is/will be cleaned properly on my return home each time and the pre-filter replaced. I know I am covid free having been in my house since the end of February (apart from treatment visits while wearing said mask) and do not need to filter what I breath out just the in. I
Just don't put too much faith in it as its no where are protective as you think. What about you eyes? , I understand this is a route of infection exceeding that of the respiratory tract.
Distance is your best protection, that and avoiding touching your face . Plus hand washing.
 

lurker

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transatlantic":gt7dicgn said:
Surely if they're going to make mask wearing compulsory, then there must be some system in place to provide people with suitable masks in the first place?

Else you'll just get people wearing handkerchiefs, or week old painters masks etc which is entirely pointless.

Or .... we'll be right back at the tissue roll thing where people hoard them and sell them for crazy prices.

I have no idea how it should work, but just telling people they have to wear a mask and letting them get on with it seems rather incomplete to me.
Define suitable mask.
If you mean for the wearer's protection , you need something costing maybe £500 plus a couple of hours training on how to put it on, take it off ( the critical action) and maintain it.
 

Droogs

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Lurker, It is a good point you make and I am aware of this. I do have access to full face systems including filtered forced air and CBRN if needed. I do think that to be OTT just now. I don't tend to touch my face as I usually have a mask on while working in a very small workshop with weak clean air ventilation (it is a building inside a building), so wear a mask all the time if any sawdust or any volatiles have been used. As to demasking drills in a contaminated environment, I am well aware as I am an ex NBC / CBRN instructor
 

lurker

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Droogs":31ygfdrt said:
As to demasking drills in a contaminated environment, I am well aware as I am an ex NBC / CBRN instructor
In that case you are part of, what I would guess is less than 1% of the population, who would get decent protection from this form of PPE. Certainly a good 50% NHS staff , who should have had training, use it incorrectly from what I have seen.
 

sammy.se

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I don't understand all the objections to masks. The logic is simple (to me): Spittle, and water droplets come out of your mouth when you talk, and breath. The mask - even a basic one - reduces the droplets being propelled onto other people, surfaces, the air immediately in the vicinity of others (e.g. as you walk past each other in a shop aisle).

No one says it will 100% defend the wearer from infection. No one says it will 100% stop the spread of the virus.
It's just a way to help stem the spread.

Everyone is so sensitive about this, it's crazy.

We wear seat belts in cars, we wear helmets on motorcycles, we adhere to a speed limit, we use a riving knife, we wear airplane belts, we wear PPE at work. the list goes on. It's just another precaution. let's just get on with it and try and be happy :)
 

lurker

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I have no objection to them at all.
Just so long as folks understand the reason why and their considerable limitations.
 

Geoff_S

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And in case of nuclear attack, hide under a table ... and other useful government advice.
 

Rorschach

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sammy.se":9sadlwuv said:
We wear seat belts in cars, we wear helmets on motorcycles, we adhere to a speed limit, we use a riving knife, we wear airplane belts, we wear PPE at work. the list goes on. It's just another precaution. let's just get on with it and try and be happy :)
Go back to what I said about masks and gloves, look at the studies. Everything you have just said there encourages risky behaviour. People who wear seat belts drive faster and more dangerously.

I am fine with masks if people knew how to use them and acted accordingly. The people I see in the supermarket acting the least cautious are the people wearing masks and gloves.
 
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Rorschach":29ijzx0m said:
sammy.se":29ijzx0m said:
We wear seat belts in cars, we wear helmets on motorcycles, we adhere to a speed limit, we use a riving knife, we wear airplane belts, we wear PPE at work. the list goes on. It's just another precaution. let's just get on with it and try and be happy :)
Go back to what I said about masks and gloves, look at the studies. Everything you have just said there encourages risky behaviour. People who wear seat belts drive faster and more dangerously.

I am fine with masks if people knew how to use them and acted accordingly. The people I see in the supermarket acting the least cautious are the people wearing masks and gloves.
So you're saying we shouldn't encourage people to wear masks as it makes them more complacent? :?:
 

lurker

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"We wear PPE at work".........
Assuming you understand risk assessments; you will know that PPE is very low in the hierarchy of control measures. And that assumes it is fit for purpose, well maintained and correctly used.
 

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transatlantic":3592qmib said:
Rorschach":3592qmib said:
sammy.se":3592qmib said:
We wear seat belts in cars, we wear helmets on motorcycles, we adhere to a speed limit, we use a riving knife, we wear airplane belts, we wear PPE at work. the list goes on. It's just another precaution. let's just get on with it and try and be happy :)
Go back to what I said about masks and gloves, look at the studies. Everything you have just said there encourages risky behaviour. People who wear seat belts drive faster and more dangerously.

I am fine with masks if people knew how to use them and acted accordingly. The people I see in the supermarket acting the least cautious are the people wearing masks and gloves.
So you're saying we shouldn't encourage people to wear masks as it makes them more complacent? :?:
I think this is precisely why they were not prescribed, earlier in the lockdown.

I will wear them as required, but still retain my 3+ metres* distancing and hand washing practices.
* I never accepted from the get go that 2 metres was enough.
 

Chris152

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I wear a cloth mask and gloves when I enter a shop, i do my shop without touching anything i don't have to touch, I leave the shop and carefully remove and bin the gloves and carefully remove the mask. I leave the mask on a windowsill at least 3 days before re-using.
I don't think the fact that some people do silly things while wearing masks and gloves is any reason for the rest of us not to use them. The scientific evidence is increasingly clear, apparently.
Perhaps govt could issue advice on how to use this stuff to help those who don't understand how to use it safely - it's not remotely complex.
 

lurker

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Chris152":lxu0nlpy said:
Perhaps govt could issue advice on how to use this stuff to help those who don't understand how to use it safely - it's not remotely complex.
Sounds reasonable, but the majority don’t even see government advice let alone heed it.

I used to work in nuclear. We had training sessions, refreshed every six months, just on how to take off gloves :shock: sounds a bit over the top until you consider how easy it is to contaminate yourself.
 

Rorschach

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My view is pretty much the same as I had on lockdown. Wear masks if you wish, I won't berate you if you do, I won't berate you if you don't. I will continue to socially distance in the same way I did before and carry out my own personal protection.
 
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