Dust extractor modifications

[tim]

I have the dust extractor below:

Model ADE2200 form Axminster.

Broadly I am very happy with it and it is powerful enough for all my needs.

There are two major problems with it (for me)

1. It takes up a huge amount of space and it was always my plan to build an addition outside the workshop to fit it in and then feed the ducting to a permanent set up through the wall.

2. The bag changing and seal is, frankly, a nightmare. I find that I have to use duct tape around the top of the bag to prevent little jets of dust puffing out wherever there is a crease and if I leave the bag to be more than half full, I end up covered in more dust than there is in the bag! Plus even though I have a woodburner that will burn dust and shavings, the bag is not an ideal storage container for this. Having just changed the bag again I was thinking that this really needs to be improved esp if the extractor is going to be outside (in the wind) for the purpose of bag changing.

The bag fills up pretty damn quickly as well and I have found that even with a bin and vortex top in between, it is powerful enough to pull most of the shavings from the planer through into the bag anyway.

With me so far?

So I have thought of some modifications that I would like to do but I don't know from an engineering perspective whether I will also be grossly affecting its efficiency.

So let me try to explain my thoughts - NB my concern is based more on my ability to explain clearly not a reflection on your capabilities to understand.

Some other things to be considered first:

1. I need to reposition the switch because it is of the magnetic interlock type and can't be operated by a slave switch in the workshop. No big deal, i'll just run the flex through the wall (assume in all cases that Part P will be adhered to! :wink: )

2. The trolley that it is on is going to be effectively redundant so that will go.

3. The way the motor and fan are currently positioned makes it impossible to push close to the wall to save space and also is too low down given that the ducting will run overhead.

4. I want to get rid of the lower bag altogether. The struts that hold the cyclone element get in the way and I've already described the other issues with seals etc.

The mods:

1 Put in a horizontal platform (25mm MDF) to sit the cyclone attachment. This will have a large hole cut in it to allow dust and debris to drop through.

2. Replace the lower bag with a more robust container eg a bin (although ideally clear or with a window to see levels). Create a seal between top of bin and platform and use a support underneath the bin and turn-buttons around the rim. I imagine the seal will need some experimentation but what I ideally want is to be able to use standard bins so that I can put a lid on the full one and replace it simply with a spare.

3. Remove the motor and fan, invert them and position high up, although using the same length of 6" hose to keep that connection as similar to the original as possible. This will put the inlet hole the right side of the extractor cabinet and higher up ie where the ducting will run through the wall.

I have drawn it in Sketchup below - apologies I'm a beginner at this and cylinders and tubes are a bit beyond me at the mo esp when curved hence the comedy hose piece.

You are seeing it as though you were looking through the door of the extractor cabinet and the workshop wall is behind the extractor.

I think we can take it as read that any warranty claim is probably going out of the window! :lol:

Let me know if you think this could have probs (or improvements are always very welcome)

Cheers

Tim

 

[Adam]

Bit like this eh?

(but bigger!)

https://www.ukworkshop.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?t=1525

Adam

 

[tim]

Bit like this eh?

(but bigger!)

Not really - I know I can build an extension on the workshop to put the extractor (as it is) in.

I'm more concerned about the implications of dismantling the extractor, turning the motor upside down and getting rid of the collection bag.

Cheers

Tim

 

[Chris Knight]

Tim,

I guess Dave will be along but you may find it less hassle to think in terms of a cyclone or a pre-collector. If you put the thing outside, a simple precollector (Dustbin type) won't take more space on your workshop.

A pukka cyclone is something you can perhaps make yourself as Dave did (https://www.ukworkshop.co.uk/forums/view ... ht=cyclone) or get fabricated locally. Either way you end up with something that requires less or no bag changing.

 

[Mcluma]

Looks good,

Try a fit on a standard wheely bin, that should do the trick,

I am also contemplating a new extractor, and like the record ones with the bin.

I would also modify it for a wheely bin, wheely bin are about Gbp 40/60 at home base, and after use you can close the lid.

There is nothing wrong with your designed set-up and should work

Keep us posted
McLuma

 

[tim]

I guess Dave will be along but you may find it less hassle to think in terms of a cyclone or a pre-collector. If you put the thing outside, a simple precollector (Dustbin type) won't take more space on your workshop.

Chris, thanks for thoughts on prefab cyclone. I already have a dustbin precollector but the draw from the extractor pulls most of the chips through this anyway. I'm also pretty keen to use what i already have rather than buy more stuff where it isn't strictly necessary

McLuma - hadn't thought about a wheelie bin - could be just the trick!

Cheers

Tim

 

[tim]

Just had a look at that link you posted Chris of Dave's titanic cyclone building experience.

That looks way beyond my capapbiliites and even with no neighbours I could guarantee the air for miles around would be turned bluer than blue with all that snipping and riveting and cutting of fingers and hands that (for me) would be inevitable!! :lol:

Great job Dave

T

 

[Travis Byrne]

Hello Tim

I have a dust collector simular to the one you have. I would also like to put it some where out of the way.
Points to ponder:
If you replace the bottom bag, you are reducing the dust collection area, resulting in reduced suction or more dust forced thru the top bag.
If you place the collection out side shop, you will have less suction unless you have openings (door,window,cracks) and then you will lose any heated air you have in the shop.
I hope this doesn't sound too neg. but just some points to ponder.
I hope that you can come up with something that works, as I would be very interested.
Best of luck
Travis

 

[tim]

If you replace the bottom bag, you are reducing the dust collection area, resulting in reduced suction or more dust forced thru the top bag.
If you place the collection out side shop, you will have less suction unless you have openings (door,window,cracks) and then you will lose any heated air you have in the shop.

Not quite sure if the firstpoint is completely true - but then thats why I posted in the first place - if I knew all the answers, I wouldn't need to ask!!

The bin will be at least as big if not bigger than the current bag so if anything I would have thought that the dust collection area will increase.

How will I have less suction? The hose joints to the machines will be the same so that shouldn't change but I'm assuming you mean that the exhaust air from the extractor won't be returned to the room? Does it really make that much difference? I don't tend to run things for very long but I suppose if its shifting 2200m3 per hour that would do it.


Would a filtered vent acting as a return between the extractor cupboard and the workshop work?

Given that it will only be on when machines are running anyway I don't suppose noise insulation is an issue. I had realised that some heat loss woudl occur but until you flagged up the suction thing I hadn't really thought about how much.

Cheers

Tim

 

[DaveL]

Hi Tim,

Welcome to the wonderful world of home modified dust collection!

I have looked at your posts and am quite sure you could make a cyclone no problem. The thing I did wrong was to buy slightly too heavy gauge steel sheet and use 4" instead of 6" hose between the cyclone and the dust bin. :x

I have the unit hooked up to a soil pipe that is in the roof space with 3 home made blast gates, look here for details. Of cause I need to rework this with the new table saw but its a very useful system. :lol:

I had a problem with the seal on the dustbin lid. :x
I had been using foam draft strip, trouble was ever time I emptied the bin, it moved and did not seal when I put the lid back. A leak on the bin gives an up draft into the cyclone and the dust is carried out through the fan instead of dropping into the bin. :?
I got quite frustrated with it and came up with a kill or cure solution that has worked out very well. Expanding foam sealer. I disconnected the lid from the hose and waxed it on the inside rim. I then degreased the outside of the bin around the rim, fitted the lid with straps to hold it in place, stood it upside down and shot a ring of foam sealer in the gap. I trimmed it up when it had set and marked the lid and bin so I could put it back in the same place. Two or three taps with a large mallet and the lid slipped off. It goes back with a perfect seal every time, best thing since sliced bread (don't understand that, I don't like sliced bread :roll: )

My blower had a NVR switch that I have disconnected and I have just bought five plug in ones from ebay, one of which is now fitted up next to the unit to allow easy control.
I had bought the soil pipe before the posts for the steel ducting was posted, I woulds compare prices, I think the steel could work out cheaper.

 

[Argus]

Not wishing to put a brake on this, but please consider two things about wood dust:

1 - Some species are dangerous to health.
2 - Wood dust atmospheres are potentially explosive.

You are creating something like a miniature silo. Please check out the relevant info on the HSE site and stay safe. I suggest that you find out if your motor is rated for dust immersion.

 

[DaveL]

You are creating something like a miniature silo. Please check out the relevant info on the HSE site and stay safe. I suggest that you find out if your motor is rated for dust immersion.

The blower I used can from a Nutool dust extractor, which when in use dropped fine dust from the top mounted filter bag onto the motor. In the cyclone setup the motor is on the top of the unit, further from the dust than in its intended role.