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Keithie

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Final machine I need is a dust grabber...fan & henry hoover is ok but not really up to it!

There are some good threads about it on here and I think I like the cyclone plan to collect fine dust from lathe sanding, p/t and bandsaw. Someone very recently mentioned a 'dust commander'

https://www.amazon.co.uk/DUST-COMMANDER ... 81YB5BM3YX

so I looked back in this forum and a few folk have added one of these to a numatic hoover (henry type thing)

I was wondering if anyone can say much about how these dust commanders perform when couple with a shop-vac?
If its any good it seems like a pretty low cost solution!

cheers
Keith
 

Distinterior

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I have the same model that I use when I'm out on site. I have mine connected to a plywood drop box that fits inside a Festool Sys 5 systainer case. It can then be dismantled when loading up and the Dust Commander and plywood box all pack away inside the Festool case.

I reckon it captures 95% of the sawdust that I create. I've had it fitted to my CT dust extractor since July last year and there is very' very little dust inside the CT dust bag.

Sorry about the picture, but its the only one I have of it set up at the moment...!!

Tim

 

MattRoberts

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I'd agree with the 95% estimate. If you keep a bag in the Hoover as well, you get three stage dust collection and hardly ever need to clean the filter.

b77bcdf6dca7229af6733816676ffe8c.jpg
 

MikeJhn

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Keithie":10wl558o said:
Final machine I need is a dust grabber...fan & henry hoover is ok but not really up to it!

There are some good threads about it on here and I think I like the cyclone plan to collect fine dust from lathe sanding, p/t and bandsaw. Someone very recently mentioned a 'dust commander'

https://www.amazon.co.uk/DUST-COMMANDER ... 81YB5BM3YX

so I looked back in this forum and a few folk have added one of these to a numatic hoover (henry type thing)

I was wondering if anyone can say much about how these dust commanders perform when couple with a shop-vac?
If its any good it seems like a pretty low cost solution!

cheers
Keith

Keith

The chips from a P/T are a different matter to the dust from sanding, the planer needs a High Volume Low pressure chip extractor which no type of vacuum cleaner can provide, no matter what the manufactures blub says, I have a twin flow Numatic 2400watt (the biggest made) and that will not clear my P/T however its fine for sanding and the bandsaw, but not the router, for those I use this: http://www.axminster.co.uk/axminster-ho ... tor-501264 fitted with the fine filter option, it transformed the chip collection out of my P/T which used to hang up material in the extraction port on top of the machine or leave chips behind on the material when thicknessing and mark the surface, it really is necessary to have the two different types of extractor with or without a cyclone, which only in real terms keeps dust away from your machine's filter and adds length/friction to your duct run.

Mike
 

Keithie

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Thanks.

Its the practical experience of it that I dont have ..so this really helps me. I can read thespecs and kinda get the hvlp thing ...but actually having lived with kit and knowing its limitations is where I'm lost!

As I see it ...the theory ...

Machine / Henry Hoover / jet 2hp cyclone / axi fm300
price / £100 / £1200 / £300
power / 620W / 1500W / 1500W
suction / 2300mm h2o / 10 inches h2o (250mm) / ?
flow rate / 42L/sec / 2100cu m /hr (=35cu m/min=35000L/m =600L/sec) /2000cu m/hr (580L/sec)

so the shop vac is higher pressure & lower volume than the big jet cyclone ...but 1/10 price

and the axi looks like it is a good choice

so its obvious to me (but maybe not right) that if the henry + the dust commander (to filter out the fine dust) isup to grabbing thedust then its way better value. so for some machines it'll be ideal, others less so.

For lathe sanding, p/t and bandsaw I think I've understood that HVLP is the right method, so the shopvac ...even with a dust commander cyclone added to capture the fine dust (and I guess reduce clagging & loss of power etc).. isnt necessarily the ideal too for my apllications.

So my question here should really be about 'how good is thedust commander plus shop vac for grabbing lathe, p/t and bandsaw dust (acknowledged that maybe nothing grabs bandsaw dust too well).

I think so far it sounds like dust commander is very good at grabbing dust ...but the vac behind it (for my purposes) needs to be more hvlp than henry (which seems like it may be more hplv)

cheers

edit ...corrected power on axi machine
 

MikeJhn

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Numatic vacuum with dust commander if you wish to extract from any of your machines that make fine particles, i.e. sanding.

Axi Fm 300 which by the way is 1500watt not 1100watt as your above post, on a 100mm duct will move 2000m3/hr this will suck up large particles, nails, small children and dogs.

Mike
 

MattRoberts

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Keithie, sorry, I missed the intended machinery from your initial post. Mike is quite right - a shop vac will never shift the volume of chips and dust from a lathe or planer thicknesser. You'll need a chip extractor such as the jet or axminster to do that.

Think of it this way - if you hold up a shop vac hose and put your hand very close, it has a lot of suction right?

Now move your hand 6 inches away from the hose. I bet you won't be able to feel a thing.

Shop Vacs just can't shift the high volumes of air / dust / chips that dedicated HVLP extractors can
 

Keithie

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coo...think I've understood now ... add a dustmaster to my henry for some stuff, get an hvlp (ideally with a pre machine fine filter) for other stuff.
thanks all
 

pike

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MattRoberts":225cu9fk said:
I'd agree with the 95% estimate. If you keep a bag in the Hoover as well, you get three stage dust collection and hardly ever need to clean the filter.

b77bcdf6dca7229af6733816676ffe8c.jpg

Matt, every time I see this photo I wonder what that blade is doing!? Makes think of robot wars :)


Keithie, you can also get a rather large cyclone for HVLP but they have recently been fairly hard to find for a reasonable price as they are not that common. Work's good though.
 

MattRoberts

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Haha, I should take a different shot. The saw blade and Japanese saw are actually attached to the lumber rack, not the dust cart :D
 

Keithie

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Thanks Pike ... I was wondering about that ...as I guess thats effectively what thr £1k+ jet/axi cyclone machines are. I imagine the dustcommander (or original oneida equivalent) wouldnt be up to it ..do you hapoen to know a brand or have a pic of one ...so I can start searching more effectively ?

cheers
 

MattRoberts

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If you feel up to it, I'd recommend making your own thien baffle for a 100mm + system. When you get to that size, cyclones are massive and take up a huge amount of space

210a613223e611d78cd66bed35ba9630.jpg
 

Keithie

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crikey Matt ...thats a good idea. Now imma need to learn the difference in uses between thien baffles and cyclones!

I found a 100mm cyclone vendor ..£110 tho .. hmm.. (and out of stock)

http://www.cyclonecentral.co.uk/Store/

making a thien baffle might be more fun and probably less cost ..and, as you say, takes less space ! (tho a bit tricky for a novice like me)

thanks
 

pike

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Keithie, I'm not sure about those cyclonecentral ones as you have to build them yourself. Peter Parfitt (New Brit Workshop) has done some thorough videos on them though.

This is mine (although I still need to shorten the hose between):

IMG_20161230_180447169.jpg


Not saying my set up is particularly clever or the most effective but it was quick and simple and works for me in a small shed. There are other ways to do things. Like fixed ducting, putting the extractor directly onto the top of the cyclone, removing or reducing the plastic bag which shouldn't get much in it etc etc.

I looked into thien baffles but decided I was feeling too lazy to make one and had a feeling I'd end up doing more than one attempt (or rebuilding if I decided to use a larger container). It would still have cost me for materials I didn't have to hand e.g. if you want clear plastic walls. They achieve the same thing as cyclones although I think the latter are supposed to be the most effective.

I agree with Matt that cyclones are pretty big!
 

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