Bandsaw Table

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martin.pearson

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I bought my bandsaw mainly for resawing as I buy tree slices & the thickness can vary a lot. Had it about 2 years (I think) but to be honest it has not really had a lot of use in that time.
I have just had to move to a different workshop & in order to make the bandsaw more manageable, I removed the table to make it a bit lighter.
Now I am trying to put the table back on & don't seem to be able to get it square to the blade. I am now wondering if I ever had it square to start with or is it possible that it could have been damaged in some way when it was moved?
 

Ttrees

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Best way to check before filing the slots is having a few blades
and having a bandsaw buddy if in a hurry.
My saw had some misalignment of the guidepost,
possibly caused by the frame distorting when being built,
(it rocks about on two corners)
and using that guidepost as a reference instead of using the top wheel as a datum point, led me to chase my tail for a very long time.
Still need to find out what the issue is there, some knocking happening hopefully just bearings from being misaligned, fingers crossed.

I noticed a huge shift in table adjustment needed when changing to axi GT blades going from thinner gauge blades, and was happy enough since until my saw started misbehaving, (nothing to do with table and was still going well in that regards)

I'd try one of those blades, or at least a heavier gauge and see how things go, I'd certainly not want to go filing the slots before that.

Lashed up bandsaw buddy thing..
Be better with rare earth magnets, as it's easier to align by eye if it were the other side of the blade.
Longer would be nicer also, but might be OK if it were the other side, so you could see a sliver of light.
bandsaw buddy .JPG


Tom
 
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baldkev

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What saw do you have?
On my startrite, theres a 19mm bolt holding the tilting bracket in place. When i took mine off and subsequently put it back, i loosened that bolt and wiggled the table, there were 2 bolts going through the frame just below, by adjusting these, it help align it.... i guess im saying loosen the fixings around the table, wiggle it, make sure everything is moving freely and then tighten a bit so you can set it square etc.
 

mikej460

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I bought my bandsaw mainly for resawing as I buy tree slices & the thickness can vary a lot. Had it about 2 years (I think) but to be honest it has not really had a lot of use in that time.
I have just had to move to a different workshop & in order to make the bandsaw more manageable, I removed the table to make it a bit lighter.
Now I am trying to put the table back on & don't seem to be able to get it square to the blade. I am now wondering if I ever had it square to start with or is it possible that it could have been damaged in some way when it was moved?
Check if the table has an adjustable stop underneath as this may need adjusting
 

MARK.B.

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Might sound daft but making sure the bolts go back into the holes they came out of could make a difference :unsure: and no crud has got into them holes :eek:
 

martin.pearson

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Just though I should have put in the original post that it is the blade in relation to the parallel guide slot that I am having a problem with, table has been wiggled about with the 4 bolts just loose enough to allow it to move. I have put a brand new blade in the bandsaw & ran the saw for a couple of minutes to make sure it is running properly.
The bandsaw is a Jet JWBS 18 M & the blades are from Tuffsaws, the one I just put in is a brand new 19mm sabrecut as I was going to resaw some air dried wood that I have had for a while.
Using a steel rule & magnet as a Bandsaw buddy, the rule is perfectly flat but just to check I did flip it around to make sure.
Had a few issues with the Bandsaw when it arrived, brand new but there were bits missing, bits not connected properly & marks on the table. To be honest I thought it must have been a Friday afternoon machine.
Could it be the blade not sitting right & would it be worth trying a different blade?
 

Ttrees

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My message disappeared after trying to upload more than one picture, check the top wheel whether adjustment is possible i.e in and out, or left and right.
Plumblines, sufficiently long level, or lasers may have to be used to do so.

Check the alignment with the heaviest suitable blade you have under tension.
Parallel co planar wheels is easier to check
Take note of 4 jacking bolts location,
If going near bottom wheel, you can damage motor bearings in 5 seconds
if misaligned with pulley.
Make sure drive belt is LOOSE, and no blade installed before checking under power.
Misaligned lower wheel plus tight belt equals broken motor bearings.
I made a video on that, as the only other video is from grizzly and it leaves out a few things.

One could ask how it runs under power without blade ...any vibration?

Top wheel parallel check.JPG

Lower wheel parallel check.JPG

SAM_4595.JPG
 
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Ttrees

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An old griggio 600mm wheels, thats been a proper pita.
It has taught me a few lessons.
Still have to find out the top wheel issues after eliminating other factors,

Has a wide blade been used on this machine before I wonder.
Not heard of anyone mentioning the difference between similar width blades before, so to me suggests something has moved.

On the other hand it could be a worn bearing or other top wheel movement
Caused by misalignment,
I'll be looking into this in the next day or so myself, so will get my post updated in a week.
 

martin.pearson

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An old griggio 600mm wheels, thats been a proper pita.
It has taught me a few lessons.
Still have to find out the top wheel issues after eliminating other factors,

Has a wide blade been used on this machine before I wonder.
Not heard of anyone mentioning the difference between similar width blades before, so to me suggests something has moved.

On the other hand it could be a worn bearing or other top wheel movement
Caused by misalignment,
I'll be looking into this in the next day or so myself, so will get my post updated in a week.

I realise you are talking about your own machine but how would using a wide blade make a difference? My machine will take a blade up to 32mm according to the manual, I have never had a blade wider than 19mm on it but have had thinner blades on it, in fact before I moved it there was a 3/8" blade on it & now I have put a 19mm blade on.
Surely if you had a worn bearing then you would have had some indication of that already especially with a wheel that sort of size
 

Ttrees

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From what I can make out, ...
On my machine (which has flat tires)
a narrow width blade will run without any trouble, but a wider blade especially if it's of thin gauge will be troublesome,
And a heavier gauge wider blade will run better and make drift adjustment , which if you like to keep the mitre slot parallel and adjust trunnion bolts instead very apparent.

Can't say for sure if the thicker guage blade will work here on crowned tires,. But I would definitely think worth a shot should one be thinking of filing slots.
Would have saved me doing so anyway.

Not suggesting you go wider, that sounds the honest comfortable limit of blade width to me,
Just reckoning the thicker gauge will likely have more set.
Probably will just hide the real cause though, and should you want to use the thinner gauge 19mm blade you have now, then it's worth inspecting the machine.

Can't be much more at play,
Whether the tires are positioned on the wheels the same or could one have moved, making the crown uneven could be another factor.

Should the machine not sit well no matter what you do,
I'd certainly be leveling the machine up, and checking everything, if the machine happens to be a bit wobbly/tippy
After failing to get my machine level after a week or two, using two plumb lines,
I made these four wee blocks to get things level.
They don't need be magnetic, bit of masking tape would do fine.
(my machine is a bit higgildy piggildy in regards to flatness, so saves finding good spots, plus I like where below is positioned)
Then you can go in for a cuppa, cuz those lines need settling/streching.
Your eyes can get fooled, and these to me seems as accurate as you can get if you have a spot lamp to check.
SAM_4959.JPG

SAM_4960.JPG


Still rocks about, but at least a sure method of it being suitable to check other things.
Yes I did buy fancy woven plumb line, but fishing line would do when used as such with the lighting favouring things.
Just two bits of scrap, some rubber/hair bands, four blocks w/tape
fishing line and a few nuts or whatever would do.
SAM_4964 (copy).jpeg


After being leveled, one could try these tests for the top wheel.
Wheel protrusion from cabinet, and left/right carriage adjustment should your machine have either.
The string sits on the wheel nuts,

SAM_4977.JPG

SAM_4997.JPG


If all works out, level machine, top wheel aligned,
east/west jacking screws matches the top wheel, and also motor pulley,
gradual tightening of the drive belt without blade, shouldn't need be tight though!
Tires OK,
then I would be looking to see whether either wheel can move,
On my machine this not apparent, but with patience can be noticeable.

My top makes strange noises,
A consistent slight knocking sound when hand turned without a blade installed,
But when slowing down after use, and also when hand turning afterwards some groaning is slightly apparent, but no noticeable knocking.

Even though the SKF bearings are relatively new, hope they are toasted on the top wheel, can possibly do some tests with the old ones, should a pair be OK for the meanwhile.
Must take belt off t'other wheel to check the ones on bottom wheel too.
Hopefully they are just damaged from the lower wheel being misaligned with the un-tiltable top wheel, because of that guidepost which is made right now,
and it's not the wheel hub!.
Think I may have some 30mm stock to make another shaft, and if I don't I can spray weld it.

Hope to use some thin gauge blades again sometime, as they are nice and scrimpy with the material.

Hope this helps in some way or another, even if food for thought regarding possible wear.

I've only made a component for my trunnion, had made a lash up before that which didn't work well, and eager to see if the trunnion plate is gonna be parallel, as squareness to the blade is relying on the edge of that plate under the trunninon.
SAM_5048.JPG
 
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martin.pearson

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Not suggesting you go wider just. Thicker which likely has more set.

No I realise that but asked because at some point in the future I might want to put a wider blade on (you never know lol) & if that were likely to cause problems going back to a narrower blade then I would think really hard before doing it.
The blade I have just put on the machine is a Tuffsaws sabrecut which I believe is a thicker blade although I could be wrong about that, I will try it with a different 19mm blade next time I am at the workshop to see if I get the same with the table, the sabrecut was a brand new blade so not been run on the machine before. I've got 19mm premium carbon blades as well
 

Ttrees

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Not suggesting you go wider just. Thicker which likely has more set.

No I realise that but asked because at some point in the future I might want to put a wider blade on (you never know lol) & if that were likely to cause problems going back to a narrower blade then I would think really hard before doing it.
The blade I have just put on the machine is a Tuffsaws sabrecut which I believe is a thicker blade although I could be wrong about that, I will try it with a different 19mm blade next time I am at the workshop to see if I get the same with the table, the sabrecut was a brand new blade so not been run on the machine before. I've got 19mm premium carbon blades as well
Sorry only seen your reply now,
I would think a 19mm heavish blade is about as wide as one would need, not checked gauge thickness of ax blades, but thicker kerf than tuffsaw carbon blades,
whether that is dependent on blade length I doubt it differs, doesn't say much on axi site.

I reckon a narrower blade, well a fine tooth tuffsaws one anyway, (only one I've got)
will hide anything, regardless what blade you used beforehand.

Tom
 

martin.pearson

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To be honest, I hadn't thought about it being level (not sure why) the building I moved out of had a snooker table in it at one time (long ago) & the guy that owned the building had used a self-levelling screed, it was perfectly flat, the floor at the workshop I have moved into is concrete but I am not sure how flat it is. My CNC has still to be moved but I already know that I am going to have to spend a bit of time levelling that up before it gets used. The Bandsaw is something like 237Kg so if the floor isn't level then it may well have a twist in the frame, hopefully, will be able to get along there tomorrow & can check these things,
 

Ttrees

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I was guessing well for my saw anyway, it may have been twisted and not getting rigged
up for the next job.
I've seen a few smaller saws from overseas, with corners resembling something
like those recent aldi courier accidents, but without the damage to the paint,
obvious corner warped, which isn't apparent on my machine by eye, but very apparent
with a small push with a finger.
so pure speculation as to a manufacturer error, could have been an accident either which would explain the broken trunnion on mine.
Whichever it was, the guidepost wasn't parallel, and this fooled me for some time.
You'll go mad if doing stuff like this craic, waiting for lines to stop, carefully not breathing incase you knock the line.
Much better to have two fixed positions and come back to it.

Hopefully this will not be the case with your machine.

SAM_4180.JPG


That's about all I can think of, maybe some others can help.

One other little tid bit from another forum I read recently, eager to try it out sometime...
A fella there reckons if you spin the wheels backwards by hand,
and the blade runs off the wheels, then there is a misalignment.

You could try this with a laser instead, riverbuilder has a video using one for construction, although I'm not convinced it is as sensitive as a simple beam with a block taped on the end would be...
saying that, I've yet to test out the new beam I've been filing, just to be sure of things.
Was afraid to ask the price of that big stanley fatmax milled on both edges 6' level,
hopefully I can make do without.
Just doubting the beam, before I attempt a somewhat tighter belt than the worn one. (duplicate replacement is much too tight)

All the best
Tom
 

martin.pearson

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Just to update this post, it was the guide post that was causing the problems, it appears that the post is not moving up & down squarely so the blade guides were pushing the blade over at times depending on which position the blade guide was in. Still to sort the problem but for now I am just altering the blade guides if I have to move the post up or down, they are cam operated so not a big deal to alter them, I will sort the problem when I have a bit more time.
 

martin.pearson

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I know my one has to be locked off otherwise I do get issues with getting a decent cut, never investigated but I can say the post is not the smoothest or most precise movement around.

The saw hasn't really had a lot of use since I bought it but I don't think I had any issues with it before it was moved, it may be that the post was knocked while the saw was being transported, it is very heavy & the guys did seem to be struggling a bit with it. Just don't have time at the moment to sort it but can work round the problem if I need to use the bandsaw.
 
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