Bandsaw selection for Men in Sheds

[Sideways]

A twist on the many "what's the best bandsaw ?" questios please guys...

I'm looking to recommend a new bandsaw to the members of a Men's Shed.
The shed was set up with a variety of used, donated, patched up equipment which include a small startrite and Elektra Beckum bandsaws - both 12".
It's a busy shed and the bandsaws get a lot of use, mostly by people who are DIYers, not experienced woodworkers, and so the limits of the machines ain't always respected. They tend to be treated as a goto machine for general cutting as they are quieter and safer than a tablesaw.
Anyway - we've raised some cash and are in a position to buy a decent new bandsaw. It's a big buy for us.
As someone who volunteers maintaining the kit we have, I want to make my life easier and the user experience a bit more reliable.

• I'm looking for a bandsaw in the £1000 - £1500 bracket to be fitted with a strong blade (say 20mm) that people will have some difficulty breaking. Ideally, I'll set it up with a good blade, set the tension, the guides, square the table, etc and apart from raising and lowering the guides, the users won't mess with it. If it's strong and stays in adjustment, they won't have to. Maybe a tension release lever would be nice.
  I'm looking for something with a really strong trunnion and bomb proof blade guides that will resist people breaking them or meddling with them.
  I'm looking for easy to use.
  I'm looking to spend other people's money so to speak so whatever it is has to come with a solid warranty - 3 or 5 years would be better than 1. I've had enough of fixing old used stuff for a bit so please no secondhand startrite advice, I totally get it, but it doesn't fit in this case.

So : TOUGH / SIMPLE / USER PROOF

I'm starting to research :

• Record Sabres (350 and 450mm wheel models)
  Smallest new startrite
  Axy Trade (the 430mm wheel model)
  Axy Industrial (the 14" one) - over budget but is it stronger / foolproof enough to be worth it ?

I'm not inclined towards Charnwood, SIP, etc but I'll admit to being unfamiliar with them. If they can provide quality, reliability and afterservice I'm open to recommendations. I don't intend to do the factory's work for them. If its bad, it goes straight back.

If anyone has one of these and can comment on whether it is / is not suited to our kind of needs, please share the good and bad points
Very many thanks in advance ...

 

[Trevanion]

Have you thought about Felder's Hammer range? They would fit into your budget and are very good machines, they're what you see in colleges so they have to be fairly robust to put up with a bunch of idiots trying to run material through as fast as they can for the hell of it. They might even help you on the price if you tell them what it's for. Your budget might even stretch to an actual Felder FB510 which having used one in work quite a bit I can say it's a pretty good machine.

The SCM Minimax are about the same price range as well and are also very solid machines with a good reputation. Although I've never used them I've heard good things. Both the Felder and SCM machines can be specified for single phase if that's an issue where you are.

I don't really have anything to say about the Record or Axminster models, I have heard decent things about the startrite bandsaws though, not amazing quality as it used to be but definitely better than most of what's out there for the same money.

Nothing really beats getting a hands-on look at stuff though, if you're up for a day out there's the W18 exhibition at the end of the week/start of next week in the Birmingham NEC. They'll have all the big and small manufacturers there so you can get a real look at all the kit. https://www.wexhibition.co.uk/

 

[Sideways]

Thanks, some great advice there. I'd registered for W18 so I'd best get along to it. I didn't realise Hammer and SCM machines could be had for that sort of money. Very interested !

 

[deema]

Ive got a Felder FB510, that’s 3ph that I’m looking to sell. It’s only a few years old and has had very little use....few hours. It’s fully braked and properly setup and adjusted. It would come with the manual and a brand new Tufsaws 1/2” blade that will cut almost everything. You would just need to plonk it down and switch it on. I’m looking for £1700. If your fairly close I could deliver.
Message me if your interested.

 

[Sideways]

PM sent

 

[mbartlett99]

At £1700 thats a steal - fyi a new Hammer N4400 wil set you back somewhere between £2000 and £2700 depending on your options.

 

[Ttrees]

Go for Deema's nice offer if it needs to be a braked machine with no work needed

 

[Sideways]

So a bit of feedback and thanks ...

I would have loved deema's FB510 but as we don't have 3 phase wired beyond the breaker board, the extra cost of wiring made it too big a jump for us at this time. I want to give a shout out to deema though for making the offer. Lovely chap and if only I had more room in my garage I'd have wanted the saw for myself !

I'm starting a campaign to educate and persuade my fellow sheddies of the benefits of a larger / stronger bandsaw. It may take a year but I think i'll get there. For a fact there are several folk who now know the names of Felder, Hammer and SCM Minimax who had never heard of them this morning

I said that we need to replace two machines and it's clear that there are two needs - one is cutting bowl blanks and pieces for toys - this can be done by a good benchtop model like the little axminster trade machine with a narrow blade permanently installed - the other is heavier cutting and here a machine like the SCM S45n (/Hammer / Felder) would be awesome. We may buy them in "reverse order" but I believe that it is a good plan an I think i'll convince enough folk to be able to follow it through.

Thanks to everyone who chipped in with advice. I'm going to be watching out for deals on the appropriate models in single phase for the next year or so

 

[Doug B]

If you want a single phase Axminster industrial machine I put this up for sale a week or so ago, just a thought.

http://thewoodhaven2.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=3602

 

[Ttrees]

What sockets do you have?
If only 13amp you may want to go for 3 phase VFD route...
I thought the Felder machine was single phase #-o

Since you didn't mention anything about health and safety requirements, I'm guessing thats not an issue?
If it is, and If you have a 16amp blue socket, then that Axminster saw looks a bargain with no fuss.

 

[Sideways]

Kinda funny. We recently spent a chunk getting electrical board replaced but pennies didn't stretch to running 3 phase circuits around the shop. Just single phase with RCBOs. Much needed.
A decent vfd costs about the same as extending real 3ph to any place we'd need it.
I'm wiring up a small Invertek drive to power a refurb harrison jubilee lathe right now as it happens.

The felder is available single or 3 phase versions but there's a tad more to the job when you have to drive a 3kW motor with a brake. All do-able but just takes a little planning and research if you haven't done it before The drives are dearer than the common 1-2 hp units too and I don't have one on the shelf.

Cheers for the heads up - i'll need to register on that forum but i'll be happy to check out your listing.

 

[Ttrees]

I could be wrong, but from what I've read the RCB's will trip from the phantom earth leakage by the VFD
You might be better off choosing an MCB supplied socket for the lathe.
You might get away it by having the VFD close to the motor with an SY cable installed from motor to the VFD
and having a metal box around your VFD.
Maybe with the Invertec drives this might not be a problem?

Can't say you need a proper brand name VFD for a bandsaw though, unlike with a lathe.

From what you're saying, it seems unlikely in your case, that you need to have to go by the industry rule book regarding VFD's... and the whole shutting off the machine and isolating the supply within ten seconds rule as with factorys and the like.

Do you have 16amp receptacles wired up?

Tom

 

[Sideways]

Hi Tom, yes 16A sockets available.
As you say, VFDs do create earth leakage currents but with the smaller invertek drives these aren't enough to trip a standard 30mA RCB / RCBO. The proper advice is however not to install more than one on each individual circuit to avoid nuisance tripping. RCB or RCBO makes no difference to the trip current requirements for these small breakers.
I haven't measured the actual leakage but I have a p&j extractor supplied from a 1.5kW invertek running off a 13A plug no problem. Peak current during startup was about 8A and on load it draws about 3.6 Wonderful things. The invertek has about 50 parameters to let you tune the drive to your application but the manuals are good and a the default settings are OK for 80% of the options.
So far all my drives have been installed close to the machines - a couple of metres of SY cable - avoiding the problems you get with longer cables between the machine and drive. I wire the remote pendants in CY and keep everything well grounded to minimise RFI....

 

[MikeJhn]

+ one for the Invertek drives, love the soft start and tun-ability to allow anything you may need to get your motor to dance to your requirements.

Mike