Bandsaw Motor - cautionary tale !

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kmcleod

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Some photos of the motor and separately the data plate would be very helpful here. I think I asked this the last time you were trying to sort this out. Knowing whether this is a braked motor or not would be a start (I have the 20" Jet which does have a braked motor but don't know whether the 16" and 18" ones do) since this makes a big difference to the price of a replacement motor. It could also be part of this cause for burning out the motor you have (if braked).

A 1.5hp motor is going to be 1.1kW so an 80 frame 4 pole flange mount motor has a 19mm shaft so photos would help confirm whether it is flange or face mount. This is for a non-braked, cap start, cap run motor from bearingboys.co.uk


Bearingboys, got the same pic as i posted plus about 6 others, including one showing the shaft length, diameter, keys slot etc, and it was them who quote £658 inc vat for a like for like replacement, becuase according to them it was a special to order from TEC to get a 19mm shaft.
 

AJB Temple

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I have a Jet 16" bandsaw and it has a 2.24 Kw motor: twice the power of yours. I wonder if they came in different specs. If it has been sat for a while unused, then it sometimes wont run and has to have the blade pulled or a wheel turned to free it up. Mine required a 16amp plug and C rated breaker to start and run properly. It will not run on a B rated circuit breaker.

If you have the blade under full tension all the time (there being no quick release lever on the 16" model), and don't use the saw much, it may well struggle to start (to the detriment of the motor?) unless you take the tension off and rotate the top wheel a turn or so by hand. Make sure you have the wheels and blade free running, and wheel bearings properly lubed - you bought it used so maintenance is unknown.

The door microswitches are also inclined to play up on these machines. I have bypassed mine.

Given your problems, I would be inclined to simply fit a pulley where the motor bolts now (cannibalising your existing dud motor if necessary) and fit an offset motor and pulley arrangement on a plate bolted to the foot plate. Appropriately geared this would enable fitting a cheap motor.

Good luck with it. I find mine an invaluable tool and very rigid compared with many of this size.
 

kmcleod

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I have a Jet 16" bandsaw and it has a 2.24 Kw motor: twice the power of yours. I wonder if they came in different specs. If it has been sat for a while unused, then it sometimes wont run and has to have the blade pulled or a wheel turned to free it up. Mine required a 16amp plug and C rated breaker to start and run properly. It will not run on a B rated circuit breaker.

If you have the blade under full tension all the time (there being no quick release lever on the 16" model), and don't use the saw much, it may well struggle to start (to the detriment of the motor?) unless you take the tension off and rotate the top wheel a turn or so by hand. Make sure you have the wheels and blade free running, and wheel bearings properly lubed - you bought it used so maintenance is unknown.

The door microswitches are also inclined to play up on these machines. I have bypassed mine.

Given your problems, I would be inclined to simply fit a pulley where the motor bolts now (cannibalising your existing dud motor if necessary) and fit an offset motor and pulley arrangement on a plate bolted to the foot plate. Appropriately geared this would enable fitting a cheap motor.

Good luck with it. I find mine an invaluable tool and very rigid compared with many of this size.


Upgrading the power of the motor is common theme with these, and its something I had been looking at before this motor went phut ! Mine is on a dedicated 16amp circuit with a C rated breaker after the last time it burned out,,,and I've done a lot of the same as you, (bypassing the swithces etc).

I do like the machine, thats why its so darned frustrating about the motor...
 

Nick Laguna UK

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Have you tried contacting Axminster to see if by any chance they have a spare motor still left over gathering dust in their warehouse?
They were the importers of your model back in the mid 2000's
Motor code was : JWBS16-218E - Motor 1-1/2HP, 1Ph, 230V
 

kmcleod

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Have you tried contacting Axminster to see if by any chance they have a spare motor still left over gathering dust in their warehouse?
They were the importers of your model back in the mid 2000's
Motor code was : JWBS16-218E - Motor 1-1/2HP, 1Ph, 230V

Hi,,yes,,,tried that when the motor when phut the first time, and unfortunately the warehouse is bare, guys were really helpful but the cupboard was bare !
 

Nick Laguna UK

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Hi,,yes,,,tried that when the motor when phut the first time, and unfortunately the warehouse is bare, guys were really helpful but the cupboard was bare !
Ah, OK it was worth a go.
Tool France are the new Jet distributors, I'm not sure if they can help or not?
Or at what price they would charge?
 

Spectric

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The motor is not going to be your main problem, it is going to be the belt tensioning system. Looking at the Jet manual your belt is tensioned by adjusting the actual motor, others like the Record machines have a fixed motor and a seperate belt tensioning system with a handle.

If you look on page 31 of this manual https://www.mikestools.com/download/Jet-Owners-manuals/Jet Bandsaws/JWBS-16 Manual.pdf

the tensioning plate easily detaches and is not part of the motor, all you need is a face mounting motor to which you can re attach the plate. The motor has four holes but no flange which may be an issue getting a motor but as said TEC can be helpful.
 

deema

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It’s an IEC motor, but it doesn’t state it’s frame size. You need to measure the motor to check it actually is a 80 frame that is indicated by the 19mm shaft. I would check the mounting hole spacing to verify it’s an 80 frame rather than a 90 frame. I have provided a table of dimensions that will tel, you want you need to know to verify it. The reason to measure a few dimensions is that it could be a special shaft that Jet have had made to make it hard to find an off the shelf replacement.
Its a 1.1KW motor rather than a 1.5KW motor. It equally doesn’t give the capacitor size, so overall the labelling doesn’t fully meet IEC regulations.
1. If it is a 80 frame it’s a special motor. I’m not aware of an off the shelf 80 frame single phase 4 pole motor. The largest I believe they normally do is 750W. A 2 pole 80 frame 1.1KW motor can be bought readily. So, the easiest solution would be to replace the pulley with one half the diameter and recalculate the belt length. I’ve linked a calculator. This might not be possible depending on how small the pulley is already.
2.If it’s a 90 Frame, then the shaft is a special, and it has been machined down to 19mm. The easiest is to replace the motor pulley and buy a 90 frame motor and drill new mounting holes in the mounting plate. You can them fit any size of motor you want as long as you check / upgrade the motor starter if you change the power rating.

The motor mounting bracket looks as though it could be drilled to take a 90 frame motor it simply unbolts.
2A806FB0-E526-4F65-B6E3-922998748759.jpeg

 
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kmcleod

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Ah, OK it was worth a go.
Tool France are the new Jet distributors, I'm not sure if they can help or not?
Or at what price they would charge?

Hi,,went t Tool France last time, eventually they quoted me close on £900 for a replacement motor, one from a Jet 18 bandsaw, coming direct from the states,
 

kmcleod

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The motor is not going to be your main problem, it is going to be the belt tensioning system. Looking at the Jet manual your belt is tensioned by adjusting the actual motor, others like the Record machines have a fixed motor and a seperate belt tensioning system with a handle.

If you look on page 31 of this manual https://www.mikestools.com/download/Jet-Owners-manuals/Jet Bandsaws/JWBS-16 Manual.pdf

the tensioning plate easily detaches and is not part of the motor, all you need is a face mounting motor to which you can re attach the plate. The motor has four holes but no flange which may be an issue getting a motor but as said TEC can be helpful.

Hi - I know its a face mounting motor, and the pics etc what was sent to TEC showed the motor with and without the tensioning plate, it also showed the mounting holes required, shaft length, diamter, keyway length, depth and width.

The result was TEC saying they couldnt help, and pointing me at Bearingboys, who did try to help, but who ended up quoting £680 inc VAT for a motor.

I know folks on here are big fans of TEC, but my expereince with them has been pretty rubbish to be fair, From the outset they were provided pictures of the existing, sizes, diagrams etc, it took two weeks and multiple emails, during which they quoted three different motors, until they then went - speak to BearingBoys. So in my experience, TEC customer service is pretty poor.
 

deema

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There was me thinking you were trying to find a solution. My error.

A one off special isn’t go to be anything any motor manufacturer is going to be interested in. I’m actually impressed they tried to help.

I would be more frustrated in buying a machine that the manufacturer had used a special part for no good reason when it should he an off the shelf standard part.
 

kmcleod

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It’s an IEC motor, but it doesn’t state it’s frame size. You need to measure the motor to check it actually is a 80 frame that is indicated by the 19mm shaft. I would check the mounting hole spacing to verify it’s an 80 frame rather than a 90 frame. I have provided a table of dimensions that will tel, you want you need to know to verify it. The reason to measure a few dimensions is that it could be a special shaft that Jet have had made to make it hard to find an off the shelf replacement.
Its a 1.1KW motor rather than a 1.5KW motor. It equally doesn’t give the capacitor size, so overall the labelling doesn’t fully meet IEC regulations.
1. If it is a 80 frame it’s a special motor. I’m not aware of an off the shelf 80 frame single phase 4 pole motor. The largest I believe they normally do is 750W. A 2 pole 80 frame 1.1KW motor can be bought readily. So, the easiest solution would be to replace the pulley with one half the diameter and recalculate the belt length. I’ve linked a calculator. This might not be possible depending on how small the pulley is already.
2.If it’s a 90 Frame, then the shaft is a special, and it has been machined down to 19mm. The easiest is to replace the motor pulley and buy a 90 frame motor and drill new mounting holes in the mounting plate. You can them fit any size of motor you want as long as you check / upgrade the motor starter if you change the power rating.

The motor mounting bracket looks as though it could be drilled to take a 90 frame motor it simply unbolts.
View attachment 131213

Thanks for the detailed information, at this point in time, given the issues and difficulties in getting a replacement motor, and looking at the work required to replace the motor, and go through all of the steps you are advocating to get it up and running, I am reaching the point where a decision has to be made if the time/cost and effort is worth it.
 

kmcleod

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There was me thinking you were trying to find a solution. My error.

A one off special isn’t go to be anything any motor manufacturer is going to be interested in. I’m actually impressed they tried to help.

I would be more frustrated in buying a machine that the manufacturer had used a special part for no good reason when it should he an off the shelf standard part.

Given the machine is both american and close on 20yrs old, it probalby was a standard part when it was manufactured, after all, 19mm, equates to a 3/4inch shaft, which is pretty common in a lot of american machines of that vintage.

Am i looking for a solution, yes, of course i am, what I also started out by highlighting was the frustrations of finding a replacement, and the joys of dealing with a manufacturer who didnt even take the time to look at the information they were provided.
 

johnbs

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I suspect your original motor might have had problems for one of two reasons:
1. Centifrugal switch which removes the start winding from circuit might have (intermittently) stuck. This would not be picked up during a rewind.
2. Lack of cooling due to sawdust build-up in the windings and or fan housing.
In your position I would look for a new motor and find a local metalworking guy to make an adaptor if a standard motor won't fit directly.

Where are you in the country?
 
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Nick Laguna UK

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Hi,,went t Tool France last time, eventually they quoted me close on £900 for a replacement motor, one from a Jet 18 bandsaw, coming direct from the states,
Hi - yes OK that's way higher than I'd have thought - plus if it came direct from the states' stock it likely wouldn't be right anyway as that would be a 60Hz motor.. they should have known that.
Given the machine is both american and close on 20yrs old
Your bandsaw is a UK CE one by the way, although it is based on a USA design. It has never been in the USA, it was imported direct from the factory (OAV) and sold as new in the UK.

If you want the 2004 UK CE manual inc. electrical diagrams , just mail me at [email protected]

Good luck in sorting it, I can't offer anymore suggestions unfortunately, I'll leave it to the others who have offered some excellent knowledge.

Cheers,
Nick
 

LJM

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Thanks for the detailed information, at this point in time, given the issues and difficulties in getting a replacement motor, and looking at the work required to replace the motor, and go through all of the steps you are advocating to get it up and running, I am reaching the point where a decision has to be made if the time/cost and effort is worth it.

I’ll happily buy it from you.
 
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