Attaching to an old church

[WoodchipWilbur]

I look after an old church (bits go back to c. 950). I have made a set of interprative boards (200mm wide x 400mm tall) mounted on 3mm foam board and they need fixing to (mainly) stone pillars. It is clearly crucial that nothing is done that will damage the fabric of the place though I think I would get away with a picture-hook pin, driven into the lime mortar that is used.

It would be helpful if at least some of them could be easily lifted off if a board is thought to be "disturbing" during a service - so I don't want to attach them permanently.

My current thought is to use (where possible) the aforementioned picture hook pins without the actual hook part and a small picture hanging D-ring, attached to the foam board with some duct tape.

Is there a better solution?

 

[Blackswanwood]

I would be thoughtful about the duct tape failing and a board deciding to drop off at a quiet moment or solemn moment during a service. You can perhaps use a piece of wire that goes through 5he foam board to form a loop?

If you don’t want to put pins in the wall the only alternatives I can think of are sticky velcro pads or a strap that goes around the pillar. I think though I would go with the pin.

Cheers

 

[Argus]

Free-standing mini-lectern type stands, about chest height that could be folded away into a corner?
I know, I know....... more work!

 

[Essex Barn Workshop]

I'd have thought command hooks would be ideal. Can be used without any damage:
https://command.3m.co.uk/3M/en_GB/command-gb/how-to/how-to-hang-picture-without-nails/

 

[Jacob]

Hang them on cords which either go around, or in between columns, or descend from a higher fixing point (if possible)?

 

[Droogs]

Give the notice boards a stronger back and attach some D hoops, then mount using bungie cords - easy removal when needed and hidden behind the boards

 

[WoodchipWilbur]

I would be thoughtful about the duct tape failing and a board deciding to drop off at a quiet moment or solemn moment during a service. You can perhaps use a piece of wire that goes through 5he foam board to form a loop?

If you don’t want to put pins in the wall the only alternatives I can think of are sticky velcro pads or a strap that goes around the pillar. I think though I would go with the pin.

Cheers

I don't think that the duct tape (actually, I'll use the better Gorilla Tape) is likely to fail on these light boards. And I am not hoping that these will outlast the pillars!

I'd have thought command hooks would be ideal
and...
Hang them on cords which either go around, or in between columns
and...
Free-standing mini-lectern type stands

I'm not so sure. Command hooks look like they rely on being on a good, smooth surface. Our pillars are rather friable sandstone/millsone grit and I've found nothing yet that can both stay attached (you generally find it on the floor, covered with little grains of sand) and come off without leaving a residue. (On a good day, Blutak or something that moulds well to the uneven surface can work - but it is a real bind to get out, specially if it has been there a while. Besides, our DAC (Church Planning Permission Guys) are not at all keen on any sticky stuff!

On cords (or bungees, Droog) - a possibility for some -but (I KNOW I didn't say!) they are not all on free-standing pillars. Some are on buttresses - and some will be on plain walls (with, in some cases) a very poor, powdery painted surface.

I have given serious thought to the lectern idea. The trouble there is the congregation. I suspect that there will be comment as it is, about "all these signs, looking garish". I suspect that lecterns will increase that. In some cases, though, that may well be the solution - where there is no convenient wall or pillar.

Thanks for all the suggestions so far! A Plan Development this morning is, instead of buying D-hooks, it'll be as easy to make them from a bit of copper wire and the aforementioned Gorilla tape. They won't then flop about to make it difficult to relocate them on the masonry pin.

 

[WoodchipWilbur]

Free-standing mini-lectern type stands, about chest height that could be folded away into a corner?
I know, I know....... more work!

The problem with our church is that we HAVE no corners! The accumulation of all sorts of semi-discarded (no one in church will ever throw anything away) "stuff" is a major problem that I am battling with - and is the driver for these interpretation boards.

 

[dizjasta]

The problem with our church is that we HAVE no corners! The accumulation of all sorts of semi-discarded (no one in church will ever throw anything away) "stuff" is a major problem that I am battling with - and is the driver for these interpretation boards.

If you have a look on Ebay uk you will find plastic strapping kits which would allow secure fixing to columns. Wire hangers could be used to suspend your boards. No drilling or gluing to structure.

 

[WoodchipWilbur]

If you have a look on Ebay uk you will find plastic strapping kits which would allow secure fixing to columns. Wire hangers could be used to suspend your boards. No drilling or gluing to structure.

... but the point is that any sort of strapping round a pillar isn't an option. One "pillar" is, in fact, a half-pillar emeging from a wall. Another one is an amalgamation of stonework that must measure some 10+ metres around. Some signs will go in a space where there are no pillars.
I did say:

they are not all on free-standing pillars. Some are on buttresses - and some will be on plain walls

Add to that, those pillars that could be used are quatrefoil in section (the shape you'd get by laying five circles together.) The strapping of whatever sort would bridge across that and be quite a no-no.

I've been thinking a fair bit today - and all sorts of suggestions on here have been really helpful. One or two of the signs will go on a simple lectern (or blackboard easel) as there's nowhere obvious to put them otherwise. The rest will hang on the little masonry nails I mentioned originally. The DAC are reasonably relaxed about the lime mortar indoors. The hole will be unnoticeable if the pin comes out.

I have made a set of 15 copper rings (from 1mm electric cable), soldered together and fitted with a Gorilla tape pad. Monday will see me with a hammer and nails. I shan't tell the DAC.

 

[baldkev]

May God forgive you

 

[WoodchipWilbur]

May God forgive you

I would like to think that He would.
We are in the early stages of a huge amount of work to save this Grade 1 listed building, set in an iconic position. We have a funding bid in that will (if we get it) allow us to spend £400k+ on repairing some of the roof - but even if we get that, the survival of the building with a dwindling congregation and a history of "apartness" from our community (partly geography - we are away from the main centre of population - and partly management - the church is locked and unavailable), depends on opening up and welcoming people. We have a huge tourism/pilgrim potential.
I am in close touch with the DAC - we correspond, probably, on a weekly basis. The DAC secretary is a person I would class as one of my friends. They know and are encouraging the work that we are doing. After years of working professionally with church furnishing, I know what the DAC get excited about and what they don't.
However, there are some small things like a few picture hook nails that they will be grateful for not having them, as it were, thrust down their throats.
I don't anticipate roasting in eternal damnation or - worse - standing at the Bar at a Consistory Court.

 

[whatknot]

For a number of signs & clocks I have made, including some slate ones which are obvious heavier than wood, I use epoxy adhesive, not had one fail yet, for light ones I use bias binding glued in a loop, for others either a saw tooth hanger, and the heavier ones I made some brackets out of angle plates, all epoxy glued on the back, all would hang on a pin

 

[jimchelt]

Just s thought...small, neodymium magnet epoxied to a pillar the painted to match. Might that work and be acceptable?

 

[RichardG]

I've found this style of hook to be reliable plus don't represent a spike hazzard when the board is removed. When removed completely the 4 small pin holes are hardly visible and disappear with a bit of paint. The short pins represent no risk to the core building fabric just a few mm of plaster.

 

[WoodchipWilbur]

I've found this style of hook to be reliable plus don't represent a spike hazzard when the board is removed. When removed completely the 4 small pin holes are hardly visible and disappear with a bit of paint. The short pins represent no risk to the core building fabric just a few mm of plaster.
View attachment 116673

but... As there is no plaster, the pins will all need to fit into a narrow mortar course between the stones. It is possible that the smalles of these would fit some of the courses but these are mostly around the 5mm width. I hope to put a few up tomorrow - I'll post pix of how they go.

 

[WoodchipWilbur]

Just s thought...small, neodymium magnet epoxied to a pillar the painted to match. Might that work and be acceptable?

Can't paint the stonework!

 

[baldkev]

I was just messing about, I'm not in the slightest bit religious. I did hear of a local church that may get closed due to no one going there and it needing a new roof, so I emailed the c.of.e to see if they want to sell ( it'd make me a fantastic house, apart from all the dead people in the garden )..... no response though

 

[WoodchipWilbur]

I was just messing about, I'm not in the slightest bit religious. I did hear of a local church that may get closed due to no one going there and it needing a new roof, so I emailed the c.of.e to see if they want to sell ( it'd make me a fantastic house, apart from all the dead people in the garden )..... no response though

No worries!!
C of E would not be the right folk to contact about buying a redundant church. You can imagine that, being C of E, the whole thing is girt about by legislation that makes the Domesday Book (in which St Andrew's is featured) look like a racy novella. But these things would be dealt with at a more local level - at most, at Diocesan level (That's the churchy equivalent of a county). And yes, the graves would be a problem. People (living ones) get very possessive of "their" graves. St A's would not make any sort of Des Res, I think...

 

[jimchelt]

Paint the magnets
to match the stonework.