Another which bench saw question.

[SimonA]

To be honest if you really want to splash out I'd be looking at Rojek, Felder, Hammer......and the likes.....I have to say that if I was looking to move to a bigger workshop I'd purchase these kind of machines.

SimonA

 

[gidon]

Hi Dan

If money and space really aren't a problem - and you need to cut large panels have a look at:

http://www.altendorf.de - seem to be, by all accounts, the bees knees!

I certainly wouldn't recommend a Festool setup over a wall panel saw. I'm sure the Festool setup is good if you don't have the money or space for a wall saw, and you need to move your setup to a job site.

I agree with jaymar - the fence system is very important and that's why I went for a Scheppach machine (TS2000). But I don't really like my Aluminium top (maybe a personal thing) - and if I could get a heavy CI machine to my workshop I would have done. The latest GMC (F&CM, New Woodworking) publications have a review (if you can call it that) of the Scheppach CI range.

Don't know where you are but I would definately get yourself along to the Tools 2004 show in Exeter. As Adam says, it's hard to beat seeing these things in the flesh. (Although not sure Scheppach are there this year - they weren't last year).

Cheers

Gidon

 

[Noel]

No, cast iron is not cheaper than aluminium but labour costs are the deciding factor. I suspect Scheppach decided to go with iron for one simple reason - the introduction of the Jet SS and more recently Fox and Sip (although the latter had less impact due to different pricepoint). I think Scheppach made a good move here as sales of similar products in the market, especially E Beckum, that still rely on aluminium have seen a massive downturn in sales. Don't forget that raw steel prices have climbed at least 40% this year thanks to consumption in China.

Noel

 

[Alf]

Welcome to the forum, Dan.

Beginning to wish you'd never asked? :wink:

Cheers, Alf

 

[MilkyBarKid]

Noelly,
I know that the price for iron has risen quite a lot but I always understood that aluminium was cheaper because you get a lot more volume of aluminium per unit weight than you do iron. This certainly used to be true.

 

[Noel]

Noelly,
I know that the price for iron has risen quite a lot but I always understood that aluminium was cheaper because you get a lot more volume of aluminium per unit weight than you do iron. This certainly used to be true.

Yes, think that's true. Add this to the other advantages of aluminium manufacture such as casting/moulding and extrusion costs and shipping. it's simply a cheaper material to use.

Noel

 

[Anonymous]

So noboby got any opinions then :wink:

 

[johnelliott]

Noelly,
I know that the price for iron has risen quite a lot but I always understood that aluminium was cheaper because you get a lot more volume of aluminium per unit weight than you do iron. This certainly used to be true.

Yes, think that's true. Add this to the other advantages of aluminium manufacture such as casting/moulding and extrusion costs and shipping. it's simply a cheaper material to use.

Noel

Aluminium is a LOT more expensive than cast iron. A LOT
John

 

[Noel]

John, OK if you say so. I'm loosing interest rapidly, especially since you and Tony, who's done a runner, originally mistakenly reckoned that I wrote that all CI saws are superior to Alu.
Please have the last word.
So Dan, excuse all this nonsense and let us know how you progress with your deliberations.

Rgds

Noel, looking for a flight to Poole.......

 

[Anonymous]

I have used a sheppach 4010 for the last year and can honestly say it has transformed the way i work. I understand they are fitting cast iron tops now but how this can improve an already deadly accurate saw i don't know. The only problem i have had is the riving knife being slightly out of line with blade and pulling the timber across. I bought it the full set up of sliding carriage, extension table and rear take off table ( a must if you are working alone ). The only mistake i made is not setting it up with a permanent extractor and the build up of dust makes the rise and fall wheel a mammoth task to turn however i rectified that last week with the addition of a record dx4000 drum extractor which sits nicely under the rear take off table and connects to the crown guard and the lower take off ( very effective ). All in all a first class machine.

 

[Anonymous]

Hi Noel

I'm back!! Sorry if I misread your post mate. rushing again!

Philly. My ALUMINIUM Kity tablesaw cuts quietly, smoothly and as accurately as I could possibly want. The fence is rock solid and the finish is as good as planed with the 40-tooth Frued blade in.

I do not dispute the strengths of cast iron and would not consider anything else were I looking for metal working machinery but it is, in my opinion, generally unnecesary for woodworking - unless one cuts huge quantities of heavy lumber every day :wink:

To be honest I do not see how the debate is relevant for hobbiest use where the machine will rarely, if ever, be used to it's full capabilities :roll:

I would expect an ali Sheppach or kity will be perfectly asequate for a hobbiest for as long as they need it - mine certainly is

 

[Philly]

Hi Tony,
If you check the earlier posts, the Gent was talking about buying his ultimate tablesaw-not a budget table saw. I have no doubt that some of the ally tabled saws are perfectly acceptable-but given a money no object, treating yourself big-time situation a cast iron table saw is a good choice ( if not the only choice). I'm not trying to put anyone down, just give good advice (I am talking from experience here ).
Also, as earlier posted, I have offered an open door to anyone who wants to experience the quality of a good cast iron table saw (or jointer) to come to my workshop for a demo. You will be converted!
best regards,
Philly

 

[Anonymous]

Philly

Money no object I'd buy your table saw without a doubt (or the genuine Delta :lol: ) - and one of those rather nice tenoning jigs too. :lol:

 

[ike]

I have used a sheppach 4010 for the last year and can honestly say it has transformed the way i work. I understand they are fitting cast iron tops now but how this can improve an already deadly accurate saw i don't know.

Dan, the CI/Alu argument is something of a distraction.

If you ask a dozen people what's the best saw, you'll invariably get a dozen different views. What floats my boat won't necessarilly float yours.

The above quote I think sums it up (not that I'm recommending a Scheppach although I agree they are very good). It's as much, if not more important, how the saw is designed and put together. You MUST go and see, fiddle and maybe try out your personal shortlist of saws and, you will know which one YOU want.

happy hunting.

Ike

 

[Anonymous]

The Sheppach 4010 has been hovering around my mind for a fair time and after the comments by Steve Wilson, it's top of my short list now ( my wife is very much in favor as she likes the colours, which as we all know is very important).

I have considered using Sheppach for all my gear, any thoughts & comments?

I don't retire until next March , so that's when it will all start happening.

My next question is about spindle moulders but I think I'll let the dust settle here first.

Thanks everyone this is a great site.

Dan

 

[ike]

I have considered using Sheppach for all my gear, any thoughts & comments?

I think it'll be money well spent. :wink:

 

[MilkyBarKid]

Anyone got any thoughts about which would be better a sedgewick TA315 or a scheppach TS4010ci especially since you can get the sedgewick several hundred pounds cheaper.

 

[cambournepete]

I have considered using Sheppach for all my gear, any thoughts & comments?

You won't go far wrong there, and if you get all your gear from the same supplier you should get a good deal as well.

edited to include quote to make more sense.

 

[Rattie]

Anyone got any thoughts about which would be better a sedgewick TA315 or a scheppach TS4010ci especially since you can get the sedgewick several hundred pounds cheaper.

Where can you get the TA315 for several hundred pounds cheaper than the TS4010? Sounds like a bargain.

The main differences seem to be in design approach. The Sheppach saws are designed as systems, with interchangable parts and accessories. Also where it makes sense they err on the side of keeping the weight down. I'd estimate a reasonably specced TS4010ci setup would come in at about 200kg. The same type of setup from Sedgwick would be about double that, using thicker steel and steel bars rather than alu extrusions. for fence and sliding table rails.

The Sedgwick equipment would appear very robust and capable, but I'm certainly coming down on the side of the 4010, for a few reasons: nice microadjuster on the fence, foldaway extension table (smallish workshop), non crippling weight, large range of accessories including that rather impressive groove cutter and the sweep adjustable sliding table rail.

YMMV as they say.

Martyn

 

[Anonymous]

Just to add a little more, the micro adjuster on the 4010 fence is so good it can make adjustments so fine you cannot see them (1/10th of a millimetre) and i have never had need to mess with the calibration of the blade angle either (unlike my previous saw), when set at 90 degrees it cuts and stays at 90 degrees. It has been so accurate i no longer use a jointer, Instead i have made a kind of shooting board with hold down clamps to secure the timber, the shooting board is run against the fence and the result is a perfectly straight square edge which can go through the thicknesser to create an equal side then turned 90 degrees and put through the saw again. I have made 60 oak windows in the last year some with 3 metre long sections of 3 inch oak and when working alone as most of us do this way is a lot easier than trying to square up on a jointer.
Also, after looking long and hard at table saws the 4010 had the most poweful motor on a single phase machine.