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I think the high quality, expensive tools only show their real worth to those that use them a lot, like maybe if you are a professional cabinetmaker using them day in day out. But to hell with rationalising the decision to buy them, heck, we just WANT them...cos we're human and rationality is boring!. I've just bought that luvverly set of Ashley Isles chisels - it's not my fault, it's Tony's...blame him, he's corrupted me! :roll: . And there's the 3 LV low angle planes winging their way across the ocean...yum, slobber,slobber! . Nope, it doesn't make any sense at all to spend all that money, when I could get any job done (almost?) as well with a set of Footprint chisels and modern Stanley plane. Nothing but rampant materialism, that's what it is, but I just WANT them...oooohhhhh, get a bucket o' cold water, quick!! :oops:
 
You don't actually have to even spend huge dosh on decent chisels - the basic Iyoroi ones that APTC sell are pretty good, and not HUGELY expensive. You can, of course, go to the extreme (£2500 for a set of 18 Iyoroi from Shokunin :shock: ), but if you spend >£10 per chisel you should be getting a decent one.
 
good topic Shady, looks like you've got ppl here thinking again over their purchases :p
Well as a pro worker in the art of butchering wood, I find myself agreeing on most things mentioned. Except - and here's the nub.
The TS is the most useful tool/machine imho, after that the jointer and then thicknesser. Cut, plane and re cut the timber to size and the sticker for a week or two, then its ready for the hand phase.
Here I agree totally that the pleasure of using a REALLY sharp plane/chisel is foremost. As I too hone/strop my blades in the morning - this gives me 20-30 minutes to think through my plan of attack 8) on the wood and to double check the joints in use for that piece of furniture.
I :oops: have a reasonable gathering of planes in my cupboard - couple of no4's [1 fine tuned for nasty timbers], a 5 , 51/4 , 51/2 2 no6's a no7 and for the final truing of any tops being made an old no 8 :)
Hoping to read more on this later, hoping you all keep your blades sharp and fingers whole :)
 
Houtslager: thanks for the observations... I know what you mean: I thought quite hard about the tablesaw's position in my hierarchy. I'm pretty sure that, were I in the business of making money, the sheer speed and utility would move it up there... For me, it doesn't do anything I can't do a little more slowly with hand tools, or just as well with the bandsaw. Conversely, I cannot resaw without the bandsaw, so that drove the 'pecking order'.

If I were doing this to put food on the table, I'm pretty confident I'd have all 4 of the machines discussed - and the biggest, baddest versions I could afford. I'd still prefer power and solidity to 'bells and whistles' though.

Interesting point for everyone: I do actually have a router (1/2" collet), which I have been known to stick in a plywood table now and again. Shows you how much I use it that I completely forgot to mention it... Main use is for moulding MDF edges when I don't want to use a moulding plane on them..
 
Now this is interesting. I think I need to alter my theory to "people like more expensive chisels, but they don't admit it as readily as they would about planes". Which still leaves the question; why? Why, for instance, have the L-N chisels caused more negative feeling on the various fora than any of their planes or saws? Why do we still insist that it's money well spent on a specialist plane, but over-priced for a well-balanced, flat-backed, fine-beveled chisel we'll use a thousand fold more often? Craftsmen of yore didn't seem to muck about; they bought the best darn chisels they could afford. I blame all those plastic handles you can wallop with an 'ammer - they've corrupted us and made us all into serial chisel abusers and secretly we all know we don't deserve them... :wink:

Cheers, Alf

Speaking as someone who's yet to spend more than a fiver on a chisel, fwiw. Available to bore for England on the subject of chisels - pre-booking not required. :oops:
 
Alf, could a possible reason for the negative image of expensive chisels over planes be in fact the tasks they are used for? A plane is used for producing a nice flat surface, more often than not one which will show on the finished piece of work. People therefore may feel that an expensive plane that gives a superior finish is worth the money because it influences what people immediately see in the finished piece.

Chisels on the other hand tend to be used more for, for want of a better term, 'fiddly internal bits'. Think about what you use your chisels for - cleaning up mortices, trimming dowels flush, etc etc. If you are very good you will cut dovetails with them, but that is beyond me at the moment and I suspect quite alot of people who bash wood as a hobby. Therfore rarely will a chisel cut 'show' on the surface of a finished piece, and if it doesnt show perhaps its not worth the serious expense of a LN chisel set.

I am neither for or against LN chisels by the way, having never seen them, just postulating a possible explanation for the expensive plane v cheaper chisel debate :wink:

Steve.
 
Alf":no821hee said:
Craftsmen of yore didn't seem to muck about; they bought the best darn chisels they could afford.

Alf, did the Craftsman of yore have any choice?

Andy
 
Hi Alf..

I'm of the opinion that a plane will be purchased before a chisel because you can see it's a tool, it's design makes it interesting, it clearly performs a task but you need to see how it's used to be able understand... whereas a chisel? that's a flat bit of steel with a wooden handle... at least that's all you can 'see' to a chisel. Even the LOML can look through catalogues and understand the price difference between my Stanleys/Records and the LN planes that i covet, i think it's about the perceived complexity of a tool.. but then i know nothing...
ta raa!

jim
 
Part 3: Working the stock.

This is where I may be challenged by some experts: rather like the pins/tails debate, there seem to be many different views on how to accomplish this phase of a project. This is the method I have found most successful for my projects. I tend to build at the ‘domestic furniture’ level: from cabinets to double beds.



I tend to cross cut to ‘rough length’ first. By rough length, I mean that the stock is at least the ‘snipe danger length’ of my jointer longer than the intended finished dimension… For me, this is about 2 inches over long. I do this so that:

a) I don’t get any snipe that will be a problem (amazing eh??)
b) The stock is at a reasonable length to work with, as opposed to some 18 foot long pole.
c) If, during the subsequent machining/hand work, I drop the piece, or otherwise accidentally bash/knock/chip it, I’m doing so on a sacrificial piece of waste. (it’s amazing how such incidents, for me, are almost always at the ends of the wood)
d) Any hand or power jointing/planing can ‘register’ properly before the finished dimensions start being cut. By this I mean that it is possible, if not concentrating, to introduce a slight bow/curve at the beginning of the cut, as the plane is not fully in contact along the length of its sole. Some may be simply too skilled to ever have this problem ( :roll: ), but this makes sure I don’t get it however tired or distracted I am…

The first thing I do to the now reasonably manageable stock is to power plane one face, to give me a flat reference face to work from…This normally involves taking out some of the inevitable cup/bow that seems to be in all the wood I’ve ever worked with…

Next is cutting to ‘rough width’. I aim to end up with a piece that, at this stage, is about ¼ of an inch over wide. This will allow for a couple of passes on the machine jointer, and finishing with the handplanes. Depending on the quality of your machinery, you may be able to go ‘tighter’, but I don’t see much point. I tend to carry out these cuts on the bandsaw with a 5/8th blade. The whole operation is far more ‘controlled’ than on the tablesaw – and that ¼ inch ‘waste’ is more than made up for by the thinner kerf… First, for really rough or much wider stock, I’ll cut ‘freehand’ along a scribed line. This cut is then passed over the jointer to give a straight edge, and used to reference against the bandsaw fence to make the second cut (using the jointed face against the fence!). I now have a piece that is about 2 inches too long, about ¼ inch too wide, and jointed flat on one face and edge.

This is now passed through the thicknesser until it is between 1/16th and 1/32nd over thickness. Remember that it helps counter warp/cupping etc to alternate faces so that wood is removed from both sides: this means that you’re going to want to dress both sides with a handplane, so I don’t go any tighter than that 1/32nd ‘excess’. Because I’m flipping faces, a scribed thickness mark wouldn’t work, so I use a pair of dividers and an electronic caliper to set and check thickness. This is the first point at which I am being really careful to get close to a measurement.

Next is the second cut that requires ‘real precision’: ripping off the excess width to bring the piece to just shy of the finish width. I will either do this in the tablesaw or the bandsaw, depending on how I’m feeling, using the previously jointed other edge as my reference against the fence, so that I know the piece has parallel sides… Again, I leave a ‘sliver’ over width that I’m happy I can plane off. With a table saw, this can be quite deep, in order to clear all the blade marks on the wood.

I now have a fully machined piece of stock with consistent thickness and consistent width, hopefully with parallel sides.

Now to the hand tools!

I work on the faces first, so that any chipping or ‘tilt’ at the edge can be salvaged when I joint the edges last… At this point, given the smoothness achieved by the machine thicknessing, I am able to use a marking gauge to mark a thickness line all the way along both edges. As both faces will receive a ‘skim’, I set the first gauge mark a ‘hair’ over my desired final thickness. How much is a hair? For me, on say a piece of cherry for a table apron, it’s 1/64th. Then, with my smoother set with tight mouth, I run over the workpiece. This is not achingly slow work, but at the same time I’m not rushing. The main focus is on reading the wood for possible tear out, and skewing or changing direction accordingly. With everything going well, I can see the ‘duller’ machine planed areas turning to a polished, glossy finish with each stroke. If everything does go well, this can be literally 2 or 3 passes over the whole surface. My shavings at this point are between 1 and 2 thou. There’s actually no real need at this stage to use the gauge, once you get confident – I use the change in texture of the shavings as my guide: the first cuts produce ‘crinkly’ ones, because of the machine planed ripples in the surface. Keep passing until a ‘smooth’ curly one is produced. This and the change in surface texture tell me when the whole surface has been smoothed. If you have counted your strokes and worked evenly across, you know that the whole surface has been brought to a uniform flatness. Check with a straightedge or the base of the plane. If the surface looks good, it is within a tolerance of your thickest shaving – 2 thou, in my case.

I then gauge to the finish width on both edges from this face. I use the David Charlesworth technique of sharpening a marking/cutting gauge blade with only one bevel – the other side is flat. As you take shavings, you can see when the gauge line ‘appears’ at the edges of your surface. At this point, the piece is thicknessed to exact tolerance, and hopefully ready for finish. If a particular area has defeated me on planing, I’ll skim it with a scraper. If you’re new to scrapers, play on some scrap first. A common mistake is too aggressive a burr and cutting angle, which can lead to great divots being taken out – not the desired effect!

Next I turn to the edges. Check the cleanliness smoothness of your vice Jaws! Mine are actually now pine: I wanted them softer than the ‘work wood’, just in case. Clamp on edge, and take one or two passes to remove any machine marks. I tend to use my number seven here. It guarantees a good straight edge, and has the mass to power cleanly along. You really need the ability to plane a straight edge. I got there after about a month of intermittent practice, and reading David Charlesworth’s advice on cambered blades and how to use them to correct an out of true edge. It works for me.

Finally, all that’s left is cutting to length. Depending on my mood, I either use my handsaws with a bench hook, or the tablesaw with my homemade crosscut sled. If the end requires precision or will be visible (as opposed to, say, stuff that will be part of a tenon), I’ll then put it in the shooting board and plane it smooth with either a low angle block, or with a number five (for the mass). You can achieve incredible accuracy with a shooting board and paper/card shims: I use ordinary paper: put it at either end of the workpiece against either the fence or the base in order to open or close the ‘vertical’ or ‘horizontal’ face.

Last observation: at this point, you have hopefully achieved a precisely dimensioned, flat straight and square, ready for finish piece of wood… Try and get all the bits done in one day, and aim to assemble the next. If you can’t assemble, ‘sticker’ them properly: they’re going to start imperceptibly trying to warp/cup/bow immediately… If you wait a week and then try to cut good joints, they’ll probably be being referenced to surfaces that are no longer ‘orthogonal’, and it will be infuriating.

Hope people find this useful… It reads as a lengthy process, but actually it isn’t. The key for me is to get into a routine: I’ll surface the first face on all pieces first, then cut the first edge on them all, etc etc etc. For the aprons of my last cherry hall table, this entire process took one morning..
 
Shady,

Good stuff!. I'm well up on the machine techniques, but your tips on hand finishing are very informative. e.g. the crinkly shavings telltale I didn't know.

cheers

Ike
 
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