A metal-working lathe query.

[Benchwayze]

Hi folks,

I need a new handle for my planer/thicknesser adjuster wheel.
I can buy one, but they're just too flimsy, and one clout from a heavy board, will snap them off. (This is the second time it's happened!)
I want to use a stainless-steel M6 x 100mm coach-bolt, as the shaft, and a piece of lead-wood to make a loose handle, to revolve around the shaft.

I do have a old, worn model-maker's Myford lathe, which I think will do this simple job.
There's also a tin full of cutters. I think I know what most of them are called, so anyone with any idea as to what type of cutter I should use, please reply?

Many Thanks in anticipation.
Regards
John

 

[jasonB]

You have not told us exactly what you want to machine, as I see it the bolt is done or are you wanting to turn the head of the bolt down?

Stainless can sometiomes be a problem particularly if you don't know the grade and old bolts are not usually the easiest machining types.

Post a sketch of what you want to machine and I'll help.

J

PS have you seen these handles, not flimsy
http://www.arceurotrade.co.uk/Catalogue ... ne-Handles

 

[Wildman]

almost any of the tools will turn the head down just get the speed right and take very small cuts, you will soon see how it is cutting. To set the tool height put a piece of bar in the chuck and bring the tool up against a steel rule gently pinning it to the bar set tool height so that it is just below dead centre and top of steel rule tilting slightly towards you. Feed gently by hand. If there is a carbide tip tool there use that iff not then any HSS tool bit will do. Make sure there is positive rake for stainless. Start off with a speed of around 500 RPM. any problems let us know. Or send me bolt and instructions and I'll turn it for you.

 

[Benchwayze]

Thanks for the replies gents.
The coach-bolts are on order from Screwfix.

http://www.screwfix.com/p/threaded-coac ... f-10/16746

Although I'll probably pick them up myself from Aston. If they are all-thread, as the reviewer says, then that would mean turning away the threads, weakening the bolt. So I'd have to think again. (Maybe galvanized would be okay, if I could get a smooth shank bolt, with enough thread to fix it in the boss. )

I was planning to add a little more thread anyway, (to give some breathing-space' and then find a brass nut, and a washer to act as a locking nut against the wheel's handle-boss, which is a blind-hole. I thought the brass nut might also be turned to act as a 'ferrule'.

Obviously the square section on the coach bolt has to be ground or turned away, so the wooden part can rotate. I was also thinking about cutting a screwdriver slot across the head of the bolt, for the occasional tightening up, if needed.

Below is the arrangement I'm using at the moment; just a galvanized set-screw, that's a bit short. It works fine, but it does look a bit rough and ready as I'm sure you'll agree. So far I haven't fetched my shins up against it, but I am sure to sooner or later!

Also a pic of the selection of cutters that came with the lathe. They look unused, and covered in grease, so I don't know if you can I/D any of them.

HTH Wildman, Although when I have the bits and pieces, I might well take you up on your kind offer. I know you'd make a better job than I can.
My lathe is in a filthy state, and I wouldn't show you a pic of that at the moment! It's undergoing a small refit, (Wash and brush up) Loads of WD40 and an old paint brush!

Jason,

The smaller steel handle would be okay, but I think it looks a bit pointy. My shins are never very far from this planer. (My shop is just 9 feet wide, and the bench is opposite the planer.) If I break the skin, I run the risk of ulceration (It's my age!) Hence I wanted something a bit more bulbous', to lessen any damage! And of course the lead-wood is a nice contrast to the steel!

Cheers.

 

[jasonB]

To remove the square section the most likely candidate is the red toolbit which looks to be a parting tool thats laying on its side. This can be mounted at right angles to the lateh axis and fed into the square part, the advantage of using this type of tool is that you will not need to have much of the bolt projecting from the chuck, you will want to run a lot slower with the parting tool try around 100rpm. Thisshows a parting tool being used to form a "head" on a narrower shaft.

You could make brass bushes for each end of the wooden handle which would run OK against the thread and then bore the handle out to say 8mm and just glue the bushes in.

J

 

[CHJ]

You do not need to remove the square anti rotation collar on a coach bolt, just counterbore the end of the handle to clear it.

 

[Benchwayze]

Thanks again Jason.

I presume by 'gluing' you mean some kind of epoxy, or resin. I know I'm probably 'over-egging the pudding' with this kind of handle, but if it looks nice, why not? I might be tempted to buy a cast wheel too! Again, why not? Woodwork is mainly a hobby these days, and I would only spend the money on beer, and other necessities like food and Council Tax!

Thanks again.
Regards
John

 

[CHJ]

......I might be tempted to buy a cast wheel too! ..

Probably less cost than the fuel needed for a trip to the supermarket.

 

[Cheshirechappie]

Actually, if you've got a file or two, you may find it's just as quick to file off the square, or at any rate, file enough of it off to stop it foufing the handle proper.

Bolts are usually awkward things to hold in a metalworking lathe without making a screwed split collet or similar. If you close the chuck jaws directly on the thread, one of two things happen. Either the chuck jaws crush the thread, or if you hold gently, the job turns in the chuck jaws, damaging the threads.

If you put a hacksaw cut across the end of the coachbolt head, you'll be able to tighten (and just as importantly, loosen) it easily with a screwdriver.

Then all you need is a nicely shaped wooden handle with a hole down the middle to just clear the threads.

 

[Benchwayze]

Actually, if you've got a file or two, you may find it's just as quick to file off the square, or at any rate, file enough of it off to stop it foufing the handle proper.

Bolts are usually awkward things to hold in a metalworking lathe without making a screwed split collet or similar. If you close the chuck jaws directly on the thread, one of two things happen. Either the chuck jaws crush the thread, or if you hold gently, the job turns in the chuck jaws, damaging the threads.

If you put a hacksaw cut across the end of the coachbolt head, you'll be able to tighten (and just as importantly, loosen) it easily with a screwdriver.

Then all you need is a nicely shaped wooden handle with a hole down the middle to just clear the threads.

Thanks CC.

I had considered that as it happens. I was wondering if I could put two blades in my hacksaw, to make a slightly wider slot. Or am I in dreamland here! :lol:

I even considered putting it in a drill press, and doing it all with files and rasps! But as you will see I am no metal-worker. (Not a lot of a woodworking lately either, but until I get these little jobs out of the way, I can't use my shop feeling 'right', if you know what I mean.

For Wildman esp.
Here's my l'il ol' Myford, I got some years ago. It does function quite well, except the rack and pinion for the lead-screw is a bit ropey. But as I wouldn't know where to start for using the thread-cutting gears, that's not a real problem!

 

[marcros]

thats a nice little myford- any idea on model number?

 

[Benchwayze]

thats a nice little myford- any idea on model number?

Hi Marcros,

Ummmm! I think it's an A3 of indeterminate age.

I wrote to Myford, with all the details; serial No. etc, but they couldn't tell me anything about it. So I reckon it's just about pre-WWII, used mostly afterwards.

The rack and pinion problem is, I believe, caused by the 'ways' being worn towards the headstock end, because I believe it wasn't used much for between centres work; hence the wear at the one end. I know it's okay, because a friend used to come and take it away for days on end, to make embellishments for the Scottish Dirks he used to make. (Sadly he's not with us anymore..) It will be useful for little fiddly knobs, and levers around the shop. When I learn how to use it! :?

(I can't spell the name of those dirks... 'sgian dearg' or something like that! )

 

[katellwood]

Would these be any good, saves making one!

http://www.axminster.co.uk/axminster-ax ... rod864182/

 

[Benchwayze]

Would these be any good, saves making one!

http://www.axminster.co.uk/axminster-ax ... rod864182/

Thanks Kat,

Yes, they would fit, but I have two of those in the drawer, each with the thread broken off. There's a tendency to clout them with planks, whilst moving timber around the shop. So I decided to make something that might be stronger, because the clouts are going to happen from time to time.

Thanks any way for taking the trouble.

 

[katellwood]

Is there enough metal in the wheel to drill and tap out to say m8 or m10 then purchase one of the larger (and obviously stronger) handles?

 

[Benchwayze]

Is there enough metal in the wheel to drill and tap out to say m8 or m10 then purchase one of the larger (and obviously stronger) handles?

Hi Kat,
The thread is already M8 and there is a cant amount left. M10 might be possible, but there just wouldn't be enough 'meat' around the thread, which would of course weaken the attachment from the other point of view.

I can buy a new wheel and handle complete, but that gets expensive. So I managed to get the broken thread out of the wheel, and decided to have a handle I can remove, when I finish using the planer. If I should forget and it happens again. I will buy a wheel with a fold-flat handle!

Thanks again

 

[Wildman]

right you don't need to turn the flats off, you must have a file would only take a couple of mins. If you think of using the lock nut as a ferrel you will undo it. Hacksaw a screwdriver slot into it for tightening turn a nice wooden handle job done. As to identification of the lathe best place is
www.lathes.co.uk
thats just about the largest machine database in the world

 

[Digit]

Turning the thread off will not unduly weaken the bolt John as the effective diameter, from the point of view of metal failure, is the root diameter of the thread. Two blades in a hacksaw is a fairly conventional method actually.

Roy.

 

[jasonB]

If you turn the threads off of the bolt you will get a loose fitting handle as you will need the hole in the handle clearance for the threaded section thats still on the end of the bolt.


Also that statement is not totally true as the cross sectional area when you cut through a threaded item is more than the area of the core dia as you are also cutting through one of the crests of the thread.

J

 

[Digit]

Ever known a bolt fail other than from the root J?

http://www.croberts.com/bolt03.jpg

Roy.