Thin Stiles on exterior doors

[steadphil]

Has anyone experience of making thin stiled exterior doors ? I have any inquiry about a door with stiles 70 mm, with 3 70mm rails, and a bottom rail of approx 105 mm. With glass panels ! The door is standard height and about 900 wide, the customer wants the rails/ stiles as thin as possible, It is a set of double doors. I personally think there is not the strength to support the weight, using mortise and tenons, and it will drop. Has anyone alternative construction techniques they've used to make such a door ? I thought about housing one large piece of glass into the hinge side rail siliconing that into place, using mortise and tenons for top and bottom rail and then cladding the other rails onto the glass using glazing tape to give the impression of individual panes. Anyone got any other ideas ? Or is it a complete redesign ?

 

[jdeacon]

No ideas on the the woodwork I'm afraid. But you might have another go at persuading by pointing out the cost of a decent narrow stile lock. A
narrow stile Chubb 3G220 can be twice the price of a normal Chubb 3G114.

That's the deadlock. There can be problems with the latch lock as well. The 40 mm backset Yales are never quite as robust or secure as the standard 60mm.

 

[Mike Jordan]

Traditional diminished stiles also known as gunstock stiles will allow you to have strength in the bottom part of the door with horizontal rails about 200mm deep and narrow stiles above the middle rail.
If you go ahead with the customers ideas, then make sure that the risk of failure is in writing.

 

[Beau]

Can the glass be used to help with the racking load? Double glazed panels are very strong. With thin rails you don't need to allow much for expansion and shrinkage of the wood. Just a thought

 

[dzj]

I've made tilt and turn patio doors with 68 x 82mm stiles.
They have hardware embedded around their perimeter that prevents the door from sagging
under DG load.
I think you refer to them as 'French doors' and they are inward opening.

 

[meccarroll]

First when you say "the" door is 900mm wide it's not quite clear weather you mean, the pair of doors is 900mm wide or each leaf is 900mm wide. Also you don't say if the doors are to be double glazed or single glazed.

If the total opening is 900mm then it is understandable that the customer would like the framing to be slim to allow light through the opening also to be elegant. If each leaf is 900mm wide then I'd be thinking about persuading the customer to allow the door framing to be sectionally larger than 70mm stiles and 100mm bottom rail.

Taking the option that the total opening is 900mm (both leafs), If I were asked to make these doors I would think of making the joints for the framing similar to double glazed sash windows. I'd use twin bridle joints in the corners of the main framing and narrow down the intermediate rails. If the doors are to be double glazed I'd be making the intermediate rails stuck on one side and morticed the other with one sheet of glass between.

If each door is 900mm wide I'd be looking to persuade the client to have the doors made in section sizes more traditional in size.

I'd probably give two estimates for this job, one with the doors in standard section sizes and one with the clients thinner section sizes. If you are concerned about the suitability of the thinner section sizes, I'd explain my concerns about the thinner sizes in the estimate, so this forms part of the agreement for the contract works.

For the thiner section sizes I'd be thinking hardwood or Accoya.