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By MikeK
#1363152
rafezetter wrote:I then use 300 / 600 / 1200 plates with the "ruler trick" and ONLY go past 1200 using paper to really polish the secondary if I'm doing finer work (which doesn't happen often) or chiselling pine as that needs the sharpest chisel you can get to reduce tearout with dovetails etc (plus utilising the "either side" technique) - otherwise for most general chiselling 1200 is enough as long as you use the ruler trick which makes a bigger difference to the edge than you might think.

David Charlesworth invented it, and has at least one YT on it, David Katz-Moses also has a YT on it for cross reference, both of those two should be more than adequate to get you started and a keen enough edge providing you follow instructions correctly.


Just to be clear, the ruler trick is for plane irons, not chisels. Never use the ruler trick to put a micro back-bevel on a chisel, as this defeats the purpose of having a flat back.
By John15
#1363171
Am I the only one using waterstones? I get on with them very well. Weather I could improve with other methods I'm not sure - judging by the posts above I could.
I use an 800 grit to raise a burr then onto a 2000 and 6000 grit. I then hone on a 12000 grit. Am I going over the top? I don't soak my stones, just spray with water when using. The 800 and 2000 dry out quicker than the others. When not in use I cover with plastic.
The sharpening process is very quick, only a few seconds on each stone.

John
By Nikolaj33
#1363302
That would work wrote:If you have a Norton India fine grade oilstone and go on youtube you will have sharp tools plus develop a very good understanding of tools and sharpening in general. And It will only cost you a short song.
Ignore anyone who poo poos this method :roll: it's simple, cheap and has been the standard for the joinery/cabinet trades for decades plus plus plus.
Next, look for Peter Sellers on making a strop and you will have everything you need.
Last edited by Nikolaj33 on 19 Jun 2020, 21:11, edited 1 time in total.
By D_W
#1363314
rafezetter wrote:David Charlesworth invented it
...


Perhaps with the exact set of devices he uses, but the "lift" has been done with freehand sharpening for a long time. It's especially popular on moulding planes from the hundred or so that I've bought.

my friend george in the states has done this freehand for at least 60 years. "lift" is his term.

Methods are discussed here all the time but what beginners really need is to understand the result and not to choose a method without understanding the result and standard they're looking for because it takes little time to find something that won't fit your method if you stick with the hobby.

I figured out about four weeks ago that I can sharpen the flat face of a beading plane with a buffer instead of a stone and suddenly they will go any direction on a board without tearout.

It will not become the DW method for rounding over the very tip of a beading plane because....

.....I'm sure it's been done in various ways for eons.
By rafezetter
#1363760
D_W wrote:
rafezetter wrote:David Charlesworth invented it
...


Perhaps with the exact set of devices he uses, but the "lift" has been done with freehand sharpening for a long time. It's especially popular on moulding planes from the hundred or so that I've bought.

my friend george in the states has done this freehand for at least 60 years. "lift" is his term.

Methods are discussed here all the time but what beginners really need is to understand the result and not to choose a method without understanding the result and standard they're looking for because it takes little time to find something that won't fit your method if you stick with the hobby.

I figured out about four weeks ago that I can sharpen the flat face of a beading plane with a buffer instead of a stone and suddenly they will go any direction on a board without tearout.

It will not become the DW method for rounding over the very tip of a beading plane because....

.....I'm sure it's been done in various ways for eons.


pedants pedants everywhere.

The "lift" method relies on muscle memory and can obviously vary from sharpening to sharpening and is there unreliable, the ruler trick however when using the same ruler and the same technique should give you the SAME result as the last time, and the time before - and right or otherwise David is indeed the person who I beleive popularised the method, and may even have been the one to "modify" and thus "invent" the addition of the ruler to the less reliable "lift" method, to give even novices repeatable results.


I've also edited my other post to reflect the level of pedantry on display here.
By D_W
#1363786
It's not a matter of being pedantic. David gave the method a name or someone else did and he popularized it (I don't know which) and has used the same term consistently, but the same thing has been done for eons.

Using a ruler makes it accessible for beginners, but it's not different just because it becomes accessible. That's sort of like saying sawing a tenon with a contraption is different than sawing a tenon freehand.
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By woodbloke66
#1363806
Mikegtr wrote:I am not to good at sharpening chisels & planes. Your expertise most welcome. I have done a bit of homework on the subject.
My question is: Which of the following 3 methods would you choose to sharpen?
a) Tormek sharpening system--is this the best method?
b) Wet & Dry paper on a tempered glass plate? --thickness of glass?
c ) Diamond stones?

When 'stropping' which side of the leather would you use to strop?

Many thanks.


If you were to throw 5 woodworkers into a closed room with the single task of 'discuss sharpening' at the end of an hour, having lit the blue touchpaper, they'd probably emerge with 1000+ variations on the theme. There's no right or wrong answer and you need to find, usually by trial and error, what system works for you, but to answer your question, based on my nearly fifty odd years at this game, this is my response to your specific questions;

a) Tormek - great (I use one myself) for removing a lot of steel relatively quickly, especially if you go for the coarse diamond wheel. This will remove steel from the primary bevel usually ground at 25deg. However, it's hideously expensive but the original and best slow, water cooled grinder.

b) Wet and Dry paper - a faff 'cos you have to stick the stuff down. Don't use it, instead go for the 3M self adhesive films (rather like a big 'Post It' note) from Workshop Heaven on chunky bit of 10mm float glass (also supplied by WH) I still use this system and it's pretty much foolproof...if you do tear a film, just stick another bit in it's place. The films last for ages before they need replacing; at least three+ months.

c) Diamond stones - I used these before the WH 3M films. They're good but the DMT stones I used were a little small and the cut was quite coarse. The 3M films give a much more refined finish to an edge

Stropping - use one (I still do) with the green Veritas stick. Lubricate the leather with a smear of Vaseline and rub well in with a digit.

Lastly, buy and use a good honing guide. I use the Veritas Mk2 which is just about foolproof. You can learn to sharpen freehand and many do, but a guide makes the whole business of finding a repeat angle a doddle. I can free hand hone btw as I used to be (in a distant former life) a woodwork teacher and could hone a complete set of bench plane blades for the workshop (that's 20) in around a half an hour - Rob
By D_W
#1364156
dannyr wrote:How many of the five would be left standing?


I can't imagine that people talk about sharpening in person. One of them would have a tablet and pencil and inevitably they wouldn't be able to resist the urge to talk about actually building something.

What can be shared sketching on a tablet is suddenly less easy in back and forth messages, so we argue about sharpening instead.
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By AndyT
#1364173
Back in 2013, member Chris Smith kindly hosted a forum get together at his workshop. People volunteered to demo various sharpening methods - oilstones, water stones, diamonds, Tormek etc.

It was a thoroughly pleasant and enjoyable session.

You can read about it here, though sadly without many of the photos.

ukw-sharpening-bonanza-get-together-t67911.html