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By custard
#1225832
Derek Cohen (Perth, Oz) wrote:Any thoughts how else this could be done?


I agree with your process Derek for cutting flats in the drawer fronts to provide a clean, 90 degree reference surface for the drawer sides/tail boards. That's the solution I use for curved drawers and it works well enough,
Dovetailing-Curved-Drawer-01.jpg

Dovetailing-Curved-Drawer-02.jpg


Reading the post I wasn't sure if you proposed to shape the curve on the drawer front before or after the assembly and initial fitting of the drawers. I think this is quite an important point. Here's a hall table with a shaped drawer front and shaped aprons, the shaping is so all these components conform to a subtle curve in the leg. If you look closely at the lap line on the drawer front you can it's thicker at the top and thinner at the bottom, so similar in principle to what you're doing,
Hall-Table,-English-Cherry.jpg


On this project I shaped the drawer front quite late in the drawer making process.

IMO it would be a mistake to shape the drawer too soon in the process. Personally I'd be inclined to shape the drawer front after the glue up and initial drawer fitting, but before installing the bottom and the second drawer fitting. Here's the rational behind that opinion,

-it's difficult to line up a drawer front on its own precisely enough to pencil in the curve from the blade. The drawer front when fitted with sides would be more accurate.

-a curved drawer front would make work holding more awkward when it comes to things like chopping out the dovetail waste.

-the thinner lap line on a pre-shaped drawer front would make chopping with a chisel more prone to blowing out past the lap line.

Just my 2 p's worth!
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By Derek Cohen (Perth, Oz)
#1225856
Reading the post I wasn't sure if you proposed to shape the curve on the drawer front before or after the assembly and initial fitting of the drawers...

IMO it would be a mistake to shape the drawer too soon in the process. Personally I'd be inclined to shape the drawer front after the glue up and initial drawer fitting, but before installing the bottom and the second drawer fitting...


Thanks Custard.

I agree with you that the shaping gets done at the end. That's what I did when I built the Lingrerie Chest, which had bowed and tapered drawers (i.e. compound curves) ...

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I managed a little more today (public holiday), and will post a few more photos soon.

Regards from Perth

Derek
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By Derek Cohen (Perth, Oz)
#1225872
Today was a public holiday in Western Australia (WA Day), and so I managed a few hours in the workshop this afternoon ("arvo", which is afternoon in Australian). The morning was filled with writing bloody reports. Aren't I the lucky one! It was great to escape back to the build.

I wanted to show some of the other preliminary tasks that are needed before one can begin dovetailing the drawers.

Here are the collective drawer fronts. They have been sized for height ...

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The original rough sawn board of black walnut was cut into three sections, and each section is enough for two rows. The rows were separated, and will be used sequentially. This is shown above.

The original test drawer front served as a template for width ..

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The plan is to work with one vertical row at a time, since each will have the same width. This will reduce set up time fitting each drawer blank.

Here is the template drawer front fitted to the lower most drawer ...

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All the drawers in this row have the same width.

Fitting the drawer front involves (1) sizing the height ... this was done (above), then (2) mitering the sides to fit the drawer opening.

Begin by obtaining the angle across the opening ...

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That was for the first row.

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This is for the second row.

Transfer the angle to a second sliding bevel (to set the blade angle on my table saw) ...

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Cut the angle on one end, and then set up the table saw for a repeat saw cut ...

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The first row is done ...

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A close up of some figure ...

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I was looking at the effect of the straight drawers fronts against the curved drawer blades. It was interesting ... no, I'm sticking to curved drawers.

More next week.

Regards from Perth

Derek
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By AndyT
#1225994
Awesome work, with great thoughtfulness, as ever.
I've often looked at high end pieces in museums - chests with curving fronts, covered in inlay - and wondered about the processes that lay behind the building of them. Your projects let me see into that world a little more.
Thank you.
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By Derek Cohen (Perth, Oz)
#1227095
I was in two minds whether to post this, but since the method is a practice, it would be great to get feedback, since the strategy I have come up with is complex. Can you do this another way?

Each row has 4 drawers, and these will be shaped to match the bow across the chest.

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At the start, the drawer fronts are to be left straight. This maintains the reference sides. The ends of each drawer front have been bevelled to match fit the bow of each drawer blade.

This is a fitted (practice) drawer front (posted last time) ..

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The drawer side has been dovetailed to the obtuse angled side (again, details in my previous post: http://www.inthewoodshop.com/Furniture/ ... kend8.html) ...

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The need now is to dovetail the acute angle ...

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This is where it gets interesting. It you look at the lines drawn on the drawer side, if made coplanar with the drawer front, the dovetails will need to me cut at an angle. That is much too complicated, and likely to be a poor fit.

Then, if the baseline is cut square (as usual), the dovetail will end up in the centre of the side (and not extending up from edge of the board).

The only way I could come up with for a fit that simplified the tail board was to rebate the pin board, so ....

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The rebate needs to be as deep as the drawer side (for a flush fit), and square to the side (so the baseline of the tail board fits flush).

The first step is to mark the baseline ...

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On the piece above, you can also see the rebate markings.

The rebate is now cut parallel to the side ...

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Remove some of the waste with a chisel ...

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Now that rebate needed to be both straight and flat. It needs to be an equal depth along its length.

It could have been chiselled, but that is less efficient. A shoulder plane as this would not ensure a square shoulder without extra work to create an absolutely square edge for a tight fit. In the end I came up with this idea to plane it using a LN Edge Plane.

A spacer was attached to plane to the 1/4" depth ...

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The finish was spot on ...

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Transferring

The rear of the tail board, with blue tape used to create a fence ...

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Tails on pins ...

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The socket shoulders are deepened to create a socket that undercuts the baseline ..

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Because the angle was so difficult to chisel, a trimmer router was used to remove most of the waste ...

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... before the remainder was removed ...

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Coming together

The fit ...

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The angle ...

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This is a rough idea of what it will look like once the drawer front is shaped ...

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The two sides that must be made for all drawers ...

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Regards from Perth

Derek
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By custard
#1227118
Derek, that's exactly how I've gone about that job. The one difference is that I cut the rebates with a router running in a shop made jig. Given that you have multiple drawers that will all need the same rebate would, to me at least, be even more reason to get yourself jigged up!
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By Derek Cohen (Perth, Oz)
#1227191
Custard, this is the first time I have used a trimmer router, ever. I purchased this little Makita several months ago at a swap meet for about $20. It is a great tool for removing waste from half blind sockets. However, I could not imagine using this or another router for the simple rebate. That is much easier with the edge plane (after a chisel). I feel more in control since it can take a little more off here or there. And it only takes a few seconds.

Regards from Perth

Derek
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By Derek Cohen (Perth, Oz)
#1227998
This is just a taste of what I will be doing for a few more weekends.

A bench shot for those that like to see how others work ...

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Below I have a few shots of the dovetailing (again). These are more to show specific strategies used, rather than dovetailing as a procedure.

The drawer fronts are moved a couple of mm past the front of the drawer blades, and marked all round ...

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In an early post I showed how a bevel was formed on the drawer front to create a square junction with the drawer side. The bevel is seen below the blue tape ...

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The ends of the drawer front angle, and it is not possible to use a jig to align it with a side. I never do this anyway, and simply use a wide chisel ...

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It's a bit of a balancing act, but the blue tape acts like a non slip, and the knife only has to make one cutting stroke to sever the layer of tape. This reduces the chance of movement and error ...

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The kerfs are sawn, and then deepened with a kerfing chisel. Note that the ends of the board are supported by a clamp to prevent splitting ...

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Rather than chop out the waste, I used a trim router to remove move of it. This saved a lot of time ...

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When removing the remaining waste, I found that the thinner blades of the Blue Spruce "dovetail" chisels worked best to pare away thin slices to the line..

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The Blue Spruce fishtail chisel is my favourite for clearing the corners of sockets ...

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The completed socket ..

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I counted on the parts going together off the saw, that is, no fine tuning for a fit. There is just not enough time for correcting the fit. This was the last drawer for the weekend. Much the same as the others. Just pushed together - no clean up ...

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This was the first row, shown here to get a better view of the design ...

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This is two rows - of drawers dovetailed on one corner only. And these twelve required an average of 1 hour each to complete ...

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The next weekend should see the remaining drawers complete this dovetailed end. I am hoping that I shall find a way to speed the time taken for dovetailing, but I am estimating that it will require a further 3 weekends to complete the drawers.

Regards from Perth

Derek
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By Derek Cohen (Perth, Oz)
#1229970
All the drawer fronts have been dovetailed. I spent some time preparing the drawer bottoms and drawer backs for next weekend.

Here is a very short video to illustrate the angles involved in the dovetailing ...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oh4_iCV ... e=youtu.be

Regards from Perth

Derek
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By custard
#1229975
So, you dovetailed 24 drawers (involving hogging out the waste with a router, a technique you'd never done before). And throughout that entire process just one slip would have been both catastrophic and completely irretrievable, as you'd chosen the high risk route of wrapped grain across the entire front.

Respect!
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By MarkDennehy
#1229981
I'm not sure who's the bigger jammy git - Derek for making it look so easy or Custard for pointing out how hard it was so you know how much harder it was for Derek to make it look easy... :D

Either way, I now know what youtube video I'm watching for most of the next hour...
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By Derek Cohen (Perth, Oz)
#1229988
Mark

Don't - it is terrible. I am putting up the full version of the dovetailing of the above. It will take a while to get it onto Youtube. It is better technically (and the chisels are sharper :oops: )

Regards from Perth

Derek
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By MarkDennehy
#1230000
That was the one I was just watching Derek, I found it interesting. I like that kerfing chisel - I just use a small and otherwise unused card scraper myself but it looks like yours has an order of magnitude more usability. I was projecting a lot during the cleanup of the pinboard though - if I was using a chisel like that, the odds are just north of 100% that I'd slip, come off the pinboard with some velocity and proceed to mortice out my own appendix (I have a few T-shirts with holes dead center in the chest from learning this while making the workbench).
It's a lovely piece of work and it's interesting seeing it coming together - things like that beveled flat to let the side meet the front at a right angle are new tricks to me.