Which grinder & polisher for sharpening and polishing parts.

[scubadoo]

Hello,

I'm renovating a number of old hand planes and chisels and think it's probably time i invested in a grinder and a polisher, or one machine that could do both jobs.

I don't really want to spend too much money but never like to buy anything rubbish that will pack in or not be up to the job. I have no experience of this and have until now just used water & diamond stones and a veritas jig.

I want to be able to use a soft wire wheel for removing rust and cleaning up, a buffing wheel for polishing brass and steel parts, and I also need a stone to grind a primary bevel on old chisels and plane blades. At the moment I'm polishing small metal parts with a felt pad on my rotex 90 which can be 'interesting' and doesn't really get the steel parts too shiny.

So my question would be:
1 machine or two?
what 6" or 8" wheels/what grit/brand of wheels - Norton 3x ?
how many watts should i look for as a minimum?
Any specific recommendations?

I've considered various thing by Clarke etc and these look interesting but I don't know if Sealey are any good.

So any advice, as always, would be appreciated.

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Sealey-BB2002- ... r+polisher

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Sealey-BG150XW ... ch+grinder

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Sealey-BG200-9 ... ch+grinder

 

[chaoticbob]

I have a Clarke 6" bench grinder (Machine Mart) - not in the same class as say a Creusen, but it's well balanced, runs smoothly and does the job. However, personally I wouldn't use a bench grinder for reprofiling chisels etc as it all too easy to overheat the blade and lose the temper. I invested in a Sorby ProEdge for that sort of thing and haven't regretted it. Perhaps more than you want to spend, but it's a very well made and versatile machine - because you can get belts going from 60 to 3000 grit it can both reprofile and grind a good final edge. Since I've had it pretty much the only use the bench grinder gets is for initial shaping of HSS lathe tools, which can take the heat without losing temper.

You should be able to find wire wheels and pigtails to take polishing mops to fit most bench grinders, so don't worry too much about what comes on the machine as supplied. Myself, I use wire wheels in an angle grinder for the rough stuff and polishing mops in a drill press for final finishing of small parts - the Sorby or wet 'n' dry/elbow grease in between.
Robin

 

[scubadoo]

I have a Clarke 6" bench grinder (Machine Mart) - not in the same class as say a Creusen, but it's well balanced, runs smoothly and does the job. However, personally I wouldn't use a bench grinder for reprofiling chisels etc as it all too easy to overheat the blade and lose the temper.

I was planning on swapping to a cooler white wheel to help with that. Is the clarke ok? i have no idea how to choose between clarke, sealey, draper, Record etc other than wanting something with a better motor and the option to get the record already with a white wheel.

I invested in a Sorby ProEdge for that sort of thing and haven't regretted it. Perhaps more than you want to spend

That looks great but sadly more than i want to spend.

You should be able to find wire wheels and pigtails to take polishing mops to fit most bench grinders, so don't worry too much about what comes on the machine as supplied. Myself, I use wire wheels in an angle grinder for the rough stuff and polishing mops in a drill press for final finishing of small parts - the Sorby or wet 'n' dry/elbow grease in between.
Robin

I'd never thought about using the drill press with a mop, does that work well? I don't suppose you'd have any more details or photos of what you use?

If i could do my polishing on the drill press that would save me some money and I could get a grinder with a white wheel and a wire brush. Is it easy to swap to a wire brush on any grinder or would i need a specific machine that comes like that?

Thanks for the advice
Dave

 

[chaoticbob]

Yes, polishing on a drill press works fine. The kit I use came from The Polishing Shop where there is quite a lot of polishing info too. Another place to look for a grinding / polishing machine would be here . Not tried them, but looks good value.
Robin

 

[scubadoo]

So I think I've narrowed it down to a choice between the Record Power RSBG6

and the Sealey BG150XW/99 with the wire wheel

The Sealey states a 450w motor compared to the Record at 370w but the Record does come with a nice wide white wheel which would presumably be good for my planes?

With the Sealey I'd have to get a white or blue stone - does anyone know what width it could take. With the Record I'd have to get a wire wheel.

Does one stand out over the other in terms of quality? I just want it to work and don't want to spend hours having to balance it to stop it vibrating unnecessarily.

Cheers
Dave

 

[Honest John]

I’ve had the 8 inch Record Power model for just about 5 years now and it’s been good for my turning tools. I stopped using a Jet whetstone grinder because of water getting everywhere, and the RP jobbies worked well when used with Wolverine type jigs. However, on or about it’s 5th birthday it started vibrating and shuffling its way along the bench on which it had sat on a non slip router mat for 5 years. On investigation the white wheel has a side to side wobble. Removed the wheel cleaned it all out, checked for snug fitting etc and reassembled, and the wobble was still there. I opened a dialogue with RP but didn’t get very far. My guess is that the spindle is somehow bent, or a bearing collapsed or some such issue. Either way RP we’re not very helpful and there were were very long periods between answers, and in the end as I needed to get back to my turning I bought a Sorby Proedge. This has turned out (no pun intended) to be a Devine intervention. The Proedge has showed itself to be so good at its job, quick, simple and repeatable, that I would never go back to a grinding wheel again. The white wheel on the RP grinder gives a good edge, but the Proedge far exceeds this, and although expensive in real terms of having to find the funds to pay for it, it’s not a decision I regret. I wouldn’t have gone down this route however if I did not have a failure of my RP grinder!

 

[scubadoo]

Thanks John,

I guess five years isn't that bad for a grinder less than £100 nowadays. Annoying that Record weren't helpful though. Was it within the guarantee period?

I read some about the Records being discontinued due to feedback about build quality and replaced by newer better built models. I wonder if that is true and if the newer ones are the ones with the white stone on the right like this?

Dave

 

[scubadoo]

Actually yes, the record website shows it as discontinued in the support section and the new model listed has a narrower coarse wheel and slightly higher rpm. Wonder if anyone has compared the two?

http://www.recordpower.co.uk/support/pa ... whitestone

 

[chaoticbob]

I doubt that you'll get a definitive answer as to the relative quality of the Sealey and Record offerings. My experience with machines in this price bracket (ie better than the real cheapo Silverline type stuff, but not in the trade/pro/industrial range) is that the variations between individual specimens within a specific brand / model can be greater than variations between different brands of roughly equivalent machines. I know this because I generally send stuff back if it doesn't work as advertised rather than spending ages fettling.

In your position I'd go for the Record because it comes with a 40mm white wheel, so you know the wheel guard will accommodate that width. There are plently of wire wheels out there which should fit the other end and even if you need to take the guard off it won't be too dangerous. It's not clear from the pics if the Sealey guards would take a 40mm wheel, and you certainly shouldn't run a stone unguarded.

Both machines are underpowered by industrial standards, but my Clarke (actually 8" now I look) is a paltry 250W - I can stall it with a heavy hand, but it's fine if I don't push it. The difference between the powers quoted for the two machines you are considering may be pure marketing. Some manufacturers quote electrical input power, others more honestly give mechanical output power at the spindle.
Robin

 

[scubadoo]

Thanks for the advice Robin.

I've decided to go for the newer version of the record at just over £70 and hope that it is set up ok. I also picked up a 6" Sealey Buffer/ Polisher as i want two dedicated machines. I've run that briefly and it seems really quiet and smooth, doesn't move on the bench at all. I'll have a go tonight at buffing some small plane parts

Is there a method for checking if the wheels are true or did yours just vibrate like hell when the became out of true?

Thanks for the help.

Dave

 

[scubadoo]

But now i've just read that the Veritas grinding jig isn't designed to be used with a 40mm wheel. AAAHHH!

 

[chaoticbob]

Can't see why the slot in the Veritas jig (if this is what you mean) couldn't just be opened up to accommodate a 40mm wheel? Come to that, why is it even necessary for the rest to straddle the wheel? I use my grinder mainly for shaping metalworking tools so maybe I'm missing something.

You pretty much know when the wheels are out of balance - the machine will walk around the bench! I have one of these dressers which I've found far preferable to the single point jobs.

Robin

 

[scubadoo]

Well i bought the record 6" grinder from FFX and the sealey polisher. The sealey feels much more substantial and better built.

I have to say i'm a bit disappointed with the record. It seems cheap and flimsy. It's virtually impossible to get the white wheel to run true. In some places the face of the wheel is not square to the side closest to the motor. Fine i thought, i can always dress that with the diamond dresser, but it just seems impossible to get the wheel to run straight and i think it's the flanges. I managed to shim it with some masking tape and got it close but it's still not great. There is still a slight wobble side to side.

If i dress that parallel to the motor shaft, will it be ok? I think not.

And the tool rests are rubbish and not parallel to to the face of the wheel.

I think i'm going to have to send it back unless anyone can give me some tips on getting it running ok.

Cheers

Dave

 

[shed9]

If your not happy with the Record, definitely send it back.

Few thoughts on the above, if you do use a wire wheel at any stage, I appreciate this is obvious but always wear eye protection - don't rely on the usual clear plastic guards over the wheels. I've had a few Clarke pro grinders and whilst robust I find they generally lack power (regardless of wattage) although I suspect most grinders in that price range will be similar. Have you thought about a combination grinder / linisher option, i.e. wheel and belt sander in one? They seem popular with knife makers for the same reasons you mention up there such as general polishing and generating an edge.
Another option to consider, especially if you already have a capable compressor is a DIY sandblasting box, it will make quick work of cleaning up and require less effort in final polishing.

 

[graduate_owner]

One option is to look around the usual online auction site for a free standing polisher, if you have space. I was lucky to be offered a Canning 3 phase polisher for less than the cost of a new cheapie grinder. ( Not from auction this time). It is only a polisher but I suppose it could be adapted to take grinding wheels. The motor is only 1 HP but is about 15" long and 12" diameter, bigger than a 5 HP motor on my 3 phase converter, and was probably built to run all day every day. At the price I couldn't turn it down. I need to sort out dust extraction for it next. Great machine, totally wasted in my shed of course, but I can't help collecting quality kit when it becomes available at affordable prices. Shed is getting a bit full now though, must stop collecting.

K

 

[scubadoo]

Just an update in case anyone ever reads this whilst looking for a bench grinder.

After 2 years, and only very occasional light use, the Record has packed up. It spins up and then cuts out. I was using it last night to put a primary bevel on a plane iron so not exactly hard usage. It always ran hot and noisy and vibrated like hell.

I absolutely wouldn't recommend the Record grinder based on my experience. I know the Sealey polisher is under less stress but it's a much nicer machine.

I might invest in something like a Creusen, maybe the slow speed one - and get a cheap Sealy grinder to run wire wheels on.

Are slow speed grinders ok for general metal work type stuff, like grinding cut bolts, cleaning up edges on steel section etc.?

Cheers
Dave

 

[ED65]

Are slow speed grinders ok for general metal work type stuff, like grinding cut bolts, cleaning up edges on steel section etc.?

Slow speed meaning around 1,700 RPM? Yes.

Just to mention, I have one of the small grinders from Lidl or Aldi. For the little grinding I had to do I figured it would be enough to last me a couple of years. It's basically a toy by comparison to better kit: ABS plastic casing, a little underpowered and the eye protectors packed it in in short order. But now more than two years on it's still working fine, and I've done some occasional extensive reshaping on it, removing millimetres of hardened steel from heavily abused plane irons and chisels.

 

[Stevebod]

..I recently purchased the smaller record wet grinder after returning the Aldi version due to really poor quality. I got the record one as I was happy to spend more money for better quality. However after 30 mins it packed up. I took the cover of the bottom to find a really cheap motor with a plastic case that had split....quality worse than the Aldi!...sent it back and will not buy Record again. A slightly higher quality grade, or a basic QA check would have picked this up before release. I guess that's what you get with the lottery that is Chinese manufacturing...

 

[marcros]

Just an update in case anyone ever reads this whilst looking for a bench grinder.

After 2 years, and only very occasional light use, the Record has packed up. It spins up and then cuts out. I was using it last night to put a primary bevel on a plane iron so not exactly hard usage. It always ran hot and noisy and vibrated like hell.

I absolutely wouldn't recommend the Record grinder based on my experience. I know the Sealey polisher is under less stress but it's a much nicer machine.

I might invest in something like a Creusen, maybe the slow speed one - and get a cheap Sealy grinder to run wire wheels on.

Are slow speed grinders ok for general metal work type stuff, like grinding cut bolts, cleaning up edges on steel section etc.?

Cheers
Dave

There was an axi one for sale on the forum yesterday. Worth a look maybe.

 

[scubadoo]

So Record have got back to me suggesting that the switch has failed. I must have used the thing about 3 or 4 times a month for 2 years.

They're also saying that because i have a wire wheel on my machine I have voided my warranty, what a joke! Good to know Record stand by the quality their products. :roll:

EDIT: They are going to send me a replacement switch though =D>