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pe2dave
Woodworker
Joined: 02 Oct 2007
Posts: 88
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| Posted: Wed May 21, 2008 3:48 pm Post subject: Compressors, nailers. A round up |
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I've spent the morning searching the forum to try and educate myself in this, a new area for me. Below my summary. Please note the caveat. Improve it if you can! Some jargon I can't find an explanation for.
TOPIC: Nailers, compressors
DATE:2008-05-21
KEYWORDS:compressors air tools nailers
General guidelines
No edge cases considered.
Guidance only. YMMV.
I'd appreciate those more knowledgable than I (Scrit?) to peruse for
errors, perhaps add extra info.
Metric nailer spraying GP Sander Airbrush s'blasting
Wkg
pressure psi 60 30-70 120 90 30 ?
Tank Litres 25 50 50 50 - 50
Flow rate FAD 5-7 8 5-10 12-15 1.5 5-10
Power HP 1.5 2 2 3 3
*Conversions
1 bar = 15 psi
1/40 m^3 = 1 cfm
1cfm = 28.3Lpm
Rule of thumb. 1 HP gives 3 cfm
*Compressors
The Clarks 'Bandit' compressor comes up sufficiently often to warrant
a mention.
Advice: If you can afford it, buy one with a pressure regulator so
that the gun in use gets the pressure it wants, not the max
output of the compressor. Compressed air can kill.
You can get HVLP guns suitable for standard compressed air from
Machine Mart at the cheaper end to DeVilbiss and Sata at the top end.
Compressors tend to be large.
*Nail guns.
Pro names: Senco. Maestri, http://www.spotnails.co.uk/
Scrit adds:
BeA is here - their UK office is in Hull and they make the staplers and nailers used in the furniture and upholstery trades by almost everyone (expensive, but very long lived and reliable). To those names add Bostitch (now part of Stanley), deWalt, Grex, Hitachi and Makita, etc. My full-head nailer is a DW and has been very reliable
See->http://www.ukworkshop.co.uk/forums/viewtopic.php?t=9312&postdays=0&postorder=asc&highlight=compressor&start=15 for Scrits advice
Ace & K Nail Guns mentioned regularly.
*Spray guns
conversion guns are HVLA guns running of normal compressors (rather
than turbines, which seem to be out of fashion). This was dictated by
the huge autobody painting industry who had existing investments in
compressed air systems. They come in all shapes and sizes from touch up
guns that will work off 4 cu ft/min to bigger guns that need a serious
compressor.
*Accessories
Air filter/lubricator. At compressor. Draper 51875
Keeps the tool happy
Don't use with paint spraying
Air filter/regulator. At compressor
Cleans air to paint heads, regulates pressure for some tools which
need a reduced level. E.g. an 18g nailer only requires 70 –90 psi.
Air filter, inline Axminster 010033. Clarke 1/4" BSP Mini Oiler - CAT74
Fits close to the gun.
Viscosity cup.
Small cup, hole in bottom. Drip rate indicates how thick
the liquid is!
To use a viscosity cup you time how long the cup takes to empty to the point where the continuous flow breaks and becomes a series of drips.
*Connectors.
Mostly 1/4inch BNP though pro units sometimes have 3/8"
PCL (Pneumatic Components Limited)
PCL quick release. Car trade std usage.
CEJN ??
1/4" NPT (possibly American?) 1/4" NPT is a tapered thread with 18tpi
wheras 1/2" BSP is a straight thread with 19tpi
*Sex (rears ....)
Generally (not always), tools have a female screw thread, so you can
fit an adaptor from that to your airline, then you need one (or two)
matches at the compressor end.
If in doubt, plump for PCL Quick release in the UK.
That would mean male at the tool end, female at both ends of the
airline and male at the compressor.
Generality seems to be:
Compressor: Male
Airline: Female to Female
Gun(whatever): Male
*Hose.
'Standard' airlines (hose) is 8|10mm internal diameter. Try to keep
it < 25ft in length to avoid pressure drops along the length.
The 'nuts' holding these together seem to be a non-metric size.
Not sure what.
Generally needs ptfe tape to provide a good seal on the thread.
*Nail selection/usage
18g -Skirting and architraves. (Possibly best GP size)
15/16 -for stud walling
22/23 -for beading
'Tarred' brads (for external use)??
Stainless brads
Masonary brads
Ring shank nails.
15g = 1.45mm
16g = 1.291mm
18g = 1.024mm
23g = 0.573mm
Seems 'g' is the guage, as in wire guages.
Hence 18guage wire etc.
*Maintenance.
Oil. For compressor, see the manual.
For the gun, could use an inline oiler (Air tool oil)
or a unit at the compressor to 'drip' oil to the gun.
*Advice:
Keep a pigtail (12" tail) connected to the gun with a quick
release connector, reduces wear on the gun connection.
An alternative is an angled connector near the nail gun,
helps getting into tight corners.
Dump coiled line in favour of better quality rubber
reinforced line, CEJN or Schrader are good makes. Braided air
line is best since non-crushable (10mm ID)
Oil free compressors are generally for DIY use only.
Cheapest way. Couple drops oil into the gun prior to use.
* Jargon
HVLP.
High volume low pressure. Better for spraying, since overspray is
reduced. Best with water based paints. Requires lots of air! the
pressure at the nozzle is as low as 10 psi.
Swept volume|capacity. Scrit? Perhaps the volume displaced by the
cylinder. Cheaper devices generally provide this ( as the X cfm figure)
FAD. Free air delivery. Air pumped out to the gun? Roughly 2/3 of the
swept volume.
RP. Reduced pressure. A half way house between HVLP and 'normal'
compressors. uses less air than the standard HVLP guns
BSP. British Standard Pipe and refers to the thread e.g. ¼ inch
BSP. Quick release fittings are usually either ‘PCL’ (long thin
plug) or Euro (short plug).
Brads: Seems to imply 18g
Finishing nails: Seems to imply 15g
Framing nails: Possibly 13g. For tacking 4x2 stuff.
Pins: Seems to imply 23g
Hence, Brad nailer, finishing nails etc. etc.
Annular nails: ring shank nails. for additional withdrawal resistance For use on flooring, fencing,[url][/url][url][/url]
Last edited by pe2dave on Mon Jun 16, 2008 10:19 am; edited 7 times in total |
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johnjin
Furniture Maker
Joined: 11 Nov 2003
Posts: 597
Location: Whaplode Lincolnshire
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| Posted: Wed May 21, 2008 5:47 pm Post subject: |
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Hi Dave
Just had a quick look through what you have wrote and I would point out that you need a female connector on the compressor and a female and a male on each end of your airline. I have just replaced my compressor last week with a new one from Machine Mart and it is an Airmaster Ranger 8/44 for about £80. This dishes up 7.8 CFM and has a 24 litre tank.
So far very pleased with it.
Machine Mart definitely seems the place to go for compressors as they do seem to specialize in them
Hope this helps
John |
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pe2dave
Woodworker
Joined: 02 Oct 2007
Posts: 88
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| Posted: Wed May 21, 2008 5:52 pm Post subject: |
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| johnjin wrote: | Hi Dave
Just had a quick look through what you have wrote and I would point out that you need a female connector on the compressor and a female and a male on each end of your airline. I have just replaced my compressor last week with a new one from Machine Mart and it is an Airmaster Ranger 8/44 for about £80. This dishes up 7.8 CFM and has a 24 litre tank.
So far very pleased with it.
Machine Mart definitely seems the place to go for compressors as they do seem to specialize in them
John |
So the sex story goes...
comp.-M F-airline-M F-gun
Is that it?
(Agree about Machine Mart from the forum stories, it gets a lot of business from here 
thanks John |
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johnjin
Furniture Maker
Joined: 11 Nov 2003
Posts: 597
Location: Whaplode Lincolnshire
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| Posted: Wed May 21, 2008 6:24 pm Post subject: |
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Hi Dave
Comp is Female then airline will be male to go into the compressor and a female on the other end to go on the male on the end of your tool. The pigtail end on your tool is a good idea to stop the main airline from wearing
Hope this helps
John |
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George_N
Master Furnituremaker
Joined: 13 May 2005
Posts: 1246
Location: Roslin
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| Posted: Fri May 23, 2008 10:56 am Post subject: |
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I've found a swivelling male PCL connector on my nailer to be well worth fitting. It helps a lot when trying to get into tricky corners.
BTW
Annular nails = ring shank nails.
_________________
cheers
George |
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pe2dave
Woodworker
Joined: 02 Oct 2007
Posts: 88
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| Posted: Fri May 23, 2008 11:23 am Post subject: |
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| George_N wrote: | I've found a swivelling male PCL connector on my nailer to be well worth fitting. It helps a lot when trying to get into tricky corners.
BTW
Annular nails = ring shank nails. |
Thanks George. I'll add that. Machine Mart had not heard of them (my branch).
Next (silly) question.
Ring shank nails, are they the ones with raised rings round the shanks
to get the nail to 'stick' in the wood better?
Are there many different types of nails?
When I saw how tiny 18g was it made me think what I'd need to keep
two 4x2's together!
Dave |
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George_N
Master Furnituremaker
Joined: 13 May 2005
Posts: 1246
Location: Roslin
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| Posted: Fri May 23, 2008 11:49 am Post subject: |
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| pe2dave wrote: | | George_N wrote: | I've found a swivelling male PCL connector on my nailer to be well worth fitting. It helps a lot when trying to get into tricky corners.
BTW
Annular nails = ring shank nails. |
Thanks George. I'll add that. Machine Mart had not heard of them (my branch).
Next (silly) question.
Ring shank nails, are they the ones with raised rings round the shanks
to get the nail to 'stick' in the wood better?
Are there many different types of nails?
When I saw how tiny 18g was it made me think what I'd need to keep
two 4x2's together!
Dave |
You are spot on with the ring shank nails, the ridges are there to improve grip.
For 4x2 framing you need a ...wait for it...framing nailer. These will handle nails up to about 90 mm and I think 13g. Some will fire full round head nails and some work with clipped head or "D" head nails.
18g works remarkably well for things like skirtings and architraves and leave a very small hole to fill before finishing (unless, like me you have a combined nailer/stapler). For heavier duty work I still use a mark I claw hammer as I can't justify a bigger pneunatic nailer. I have almost convinced myself that I need (want really) a small portable compressor for trim work around the house because it is too much hassle to drag the workshop compressor around. However this will be subject to approval by the minister of finance and that will be harder to come by.
_________________
cheers
George |
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Scrit
Master Cabinetmaker
Joined: 17 Sep 2002
Posts: 3872
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| Posted: Sun Jun 15, 2008 7:48 pm Post subject: Re: Compressors, nailers. A round up |
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Well, as my name was mentioned.......
| pe2dave wrote: | Advice: If you can afford it, buy one with a pressure regulator so
that the gun in use gets the pressure it wants, not the max
output of the compressor. Compressed air can kill. |
It's as much to do with increasing the life of your tools and air lines. A reinforced poly airline run at 150psi simply won't last as long as one run at 100psi. Similarly if the tool is rated at 80psi, running it at 120psi will do for the seals earlier. And one thing about compressed air tools is their durability if properly maintained (and that means correct pressure and regular lubrication)
| pe2dave wrote: | | You can get HVLP guns suitable for standard compressed air from Machine Mart at the cheaper end to DeVilbiss and Sata at the top end. |
The problem is that HVLP conversion guns tend to require big compressors to run them
BeA (not BAE) is here - their UK office is in Hull and they make the staplers and nailers used in the furniture and upholstery trades by almost everyone (expensive, but very long lived and reliable). To those names add Bostitch (now part of Stanley), deWalt, Grex, Hitachi and Makita, etc. My full-head nailer is a DW and has been very reliable
| pe2dave wrote: | Viscosity cup.
Small cup, hole bottom. Drip rate indicates how thick
the liquid is! |
Not quite. The same result can be had by using mixing cups (normal in industrial applications) and adjusting the amount of thinners to create the correct spray pattern
| pe2dave wrote: | *Connectors.
Mostly 1/4inch BNP though pro units sometimes have 3/8"
PCL (Pneumatic Components Limited)
PCL quick release. Car trade std usage.
CEJN ??
1/4" NPT (possibly American?) 1/4" NPT is a tapered thread with 18tpi
wheras 1/2" BSP is a straight thread with 19tpi |
CEJN are high airflow fittings - PCL offer a CEJN 310-compatible fitting called an XZN (?) I believe. Fit a "pigtail" on the tool - a short length of hose some 6 to 24in long with a male connector - this will reduce the tendency to crack the back of the tool by repeated coupling/uncoupling and is the recommended approach (amongst others bty the HSE). Air lines should always be male at one end, female at the other with a female self-sealer at the compressor end (which also requires a stop cock as well as a regulator/gauge). If you had a male the air would vent to atmosphere if no tool were connected
If you want some idea of the variety available take a look at Flowtech's web site.
| pe2dave wrote: | *Nail selection/usage
18g -Skirting and architraves. (Possibly best GP size)
15/16 -for stud walling
22/23 -for beading |
Not really....... 16g for architrave and skirting unless it's clear-finish solid wood in which case 18g is acceptable. Either way back-up with glue/GripFill (required in the Building Regs).
15 or 16 gauge for lightweight constructions, although I know very few people who use 15 gauge, however for studding you really need a framing nailer capable of delivering a clipped-head (or better a full head) nail. One plus point of 15 gauge is that many of the guns have angled magazines which are better for working into awkward corners (many 16 gauge guns are straight magazine tools)
One point about compressed air tools in construction over cordless nailers (such as the deWalt and Senco battery powered and Hitachi, Spit, Passlode, etc gas-powered jobbies) is that you need to be somewhate more organised to avoid the need to drag a compressor and nails all over the site. On the other hand if you need something like a T-head nailer (used to secure timber battens onto concrete), a strapshot nailer (used to fix ironmongery such as metal joist hangers onto wall plates) or a coil nailer (used in pallet making and roof cladding) then there's little choice other than to go compressed air
Decking, fencing and roofing can be done with a clipped-head nailer but anything in an exposed position is much better done with a full-head nailer as they have significantly better holding power than the clipped heads. Following Hurricane Katrina many states in the USA are either considering or have already legislated against the use of clipped head nails in exterior and load-bearing structures due to their somewhat limited pull-out resistance.
Ring annulars give better holding and pull-out resistance than plain nails, but, anything constructed with these is difficult to dismantle (so plains are better for temporary signs, fences, etc which need to be subsequently dismantled not to mention cheaper/quicker than screwing)
I hope the additional info is of assistance
Scrit
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pe2dave
Woodworker
Joined: 02 Oct 2007
Posts: 88
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| Posted: Mon Jun 16, 2008 7:50 am Post subject: Re: Compressors, nailers. A round up |
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Thanks Scrit. Just one clarification please.
| pe2dave wrote: | Viscosity cup.
Small cup, hole bottom. Drip rate indicates how thick
the liquid is! |
| Quote: | | Not quite. The same result can be had by using mixing cups (normal in industrial applications) and adjusting the amount of thinners to create the correct spray patternScrit |
How is it 'not quite' Scrit? What is a viscosity cup? |
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Guest
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| Posted: Mon Jun 16, 2008 9:07 am Post subject: Re: Compressors, nailers. A round up |
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| Quote: |
How is it 'not quite' Scrit? What is a viscosity cup? |
Not Scrit but..
To use a viscosity cup you time how long the cup takes to empty to the point where the continous flow breaks and becomes a series of drips. |
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pe2dave
Woodworker
Joined: 02 Oct 2007
Posts: 88
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| Posted: Mon Jun 16, 2008 10:21 am Post subject: Re: Compressors, nailers. A round up |
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| MDF_HAKA wrote: |
Not Scrit but..
To use a viscosity cup you time how long the cup takes to empty to the point where the continous flow breaks and becomes a series of drips. |
Ah! Better. Thanks 'mdf_haka', I've added it.Is it worth asking the moderator if we can 'clean up' this set and just add them all into the main post? With attribution of course. |
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