Unidentified Found Objects

[DigitalM]

Somewhat misleading title, but here are some things found amongst auction multi-lots.

UFO 1: I literally have no idea. It might be fun to guess, or maybe someone knows. Either way it's broken but I'm still curious as to what it was.

UFO 2: Obviously a pointy tool. I'm a noob I know, but I'm wondering if this is for a specific trade rather than general pointy pokey thing.

UFO 3: Looks like a needle on a handle. Something for saddlery perhaps?

UFO 4: Probably an easy one. This thing looks a bit like a small woodworking lathe parting tool. Maybe that's exactly what it is. It's stamped "H. Taylor Made in England" and has an acorn logo. I see they do turning tools, but on their parting tool page there's nothing modern that matches this sort of profile.

 

[bugbear]

4 is a carving chisel of some kind.

BugBear

 

[bugbear]

I think 2+3 might form a pair. 2 doesn't look like a woodworking bradawl to me.

http://www.artisanleather.co.uk/sewing- ... -awls.html

BugBear

 

[DigitalM]

I think 2+3 might form a pair. 2 doesn't look like a woodworking bradawl to me.

http://www.artisanleather.co.uk/sewing- ... -awls.html

BugBear

Not sure they are a pair myself, although they came from the same large lot.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

3 possibly for rug making.

 

[bugbear]

(3) is clearly intended to pull something pretty hard - note the cross pin in the handle, holding the shaft. But most pulling type tools are either hooks, or latch-hooks, for ease of use.

I'm sure I've seen this before, but I can't remember where.

BugBear

 

[Jacob]

UFO 1 is almost certainly a door closer. Mounted on a sprung hinge (missing) on the frame with the arm across the door and the trunnion riding on a brass strip. I've got similar in a box somewhere (I keep a lot of old ironmongery).

 

[bugbear]

I'm starting to think 3 is something to do with splicing, knotting or whipping - rope work, sail making kind of activity.

BugBear

 

[DigitalM]

1,2 could be a door closer. Mounted on a sprung hinge (missing) on the frame with the arm across the door and the trunnion riding on a brass strip. I've got similar in a box somewhere (I keep a lot of old ironmongery).

I can imagine that. It seems logical that it's for applying pressure to something by means of the levering action of the arm, with the wheel running over the object against which the force is exerted.

 

[DigitalM]

Well I never, I may have uncovered my own UFO #2:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scratch_awl

Scratch awl or scratching awl. Basically a woodworking scribe. I'd not heard of this before. I stumbled across this when looking at the bradawl page on wikipedia.

Edit: The page also notes they're used for layout in leather working, so perhaps that tied in with the UFO #3.

 

[Tasky]

UFO 3: Looks like a needle on a handle. Something for saddlery perhaps?

That's what I'd have said. Some kind of sewing awl for lockstitching something... maybe not leather, but something quite thick, from the length of the tool.
Might it have had a point at one stage?

https://www.collectorsweekly.com/storie ... 1-activity

 

[AndyT]

Pretty sure No 3 is not for leather work. I've had a fairly careful look through Salaman's Dictionary of Leatherworking Tools (am I still the only one round here with a copy? Seriously? )

It's not for sails either - it's not found in Des Pawson's lecture notes on sailmakers' and riggers' tools.

But if you do an image search for a rag rug bodkin...

 

[AndyT]

Awls are really difficult to identify with any certainty. From a modern perspective there are so many catalogue pictures which look the same. But maybe in their time there was a clear difference in the springiness of the steel or the hardness of the point which distinguished one from another.

I agree that No 4 is a carving chisel - if you look at a list of the standard sweeps, No 1 is actually flat, but the bevel on both sides is the clue. It's got a tang and is quite light weight, so it's not for turning.

 

[Jacob]

Pointy thing and hole thing both may be termed "bodkin" in some trades.
But i general "awl" will do for the pointy thing.

 

[DigitalM]

Pretty sure No 3 is not for leather work. I've had a fairly careful look through Salaman's Dictionary of Leatherworking Tools (am I still the only one round here with a copy? Seriously? )

It's not for sails either - it's not found in Des Pawson's lecture notes on sailmakers' and riggers' tools.

But if you do an image search for a rag rug bodkin...

Thanks for looking those up. Must have a serious library there!

I see what you mean about the rag rug connection, though I wonder if there is another connection. There are a few tools that are similar. It doesn't really fit in with the other tools though, but is just the sort of thing you'd pick up in a hardware shop or ironmongers to solve a problem not related to the tools original use, or maybe whip out of your partner's sewing kit and forget to return.

 

[DigitalM]

UFO #3 = Lawyer's Bodkin coming up with some interesting results, although those are really sharp for piercing paper and then presumably tagging them.

 

[AndyT]

Here's a bit more from Salaman on identifying awls.

Boot and shoe makers used awls to pierce holes for the stitching, but the holes needed to be matched to the size of the thread so it didn't leak. Awls came in a wide range of sizes. The thread was attached to a stiff bristle on the end which served as a same-thickness needle which did not enlarge the hole. Their awls were generally flat oval in cross section for sewing horizontally or flat rectangular for stitching vertically.

Saddlers' awls are generally diamond shaped in cross section.

Sailmakers' needles are triangular in cross section and can be found mounted in handles as awls.

I'm summarising a lot - there are pages of these, which is hardly surprising for a tool that goes back thousands of years.

I should have said for no 3 that it's significant that it does not have a sharp point, which is why I don't think it would have made its own hole, like a stationer's awl would. But for rag rugs based on open weave sacking or hessian, a sharp point would be a disadvantage as it would tend to split the coarse fibres rather than just separate them.

 

[DigitalM]

I agree that No 4 is a carving chisel - if you look at a list of the standard sweeps, No 1 is actually flat, but the bevel on both sides is the clue. It's got a tang and is quite light weight, so it's not for turning

Just noticed this is stamped with a 1 - it's not terribly clear but I think that's what it is.

 

[DigitalM]

I should have said for no 3 that it's significant that it does not have a sharp point, which is why I don't think it would have made its own hole, like a stationer's awl would. But for rag rugs based on open weave sacking or hessian, a sharp point would be a disadvantage as it would tend to split the coarse fibres rather than just separate them.

Your logic makes sense. The only thing that leads me to think it's not rug making is that it's not latched. Perhaps that's just a modern thing though. Not having done any rug making I can't confirm! The latching of those tools suggest that it's some for of looping/knotting technique rather than threading - where you thread the tool through, open it, load it, then pull it back through. I guess you could push a loop through though.

To be honest I thought there was going to be a really definitive answer on this one almost straight away.

Sorry about all the thinking out loud! I genuinely enjoy the detective work on these things!

 

[AndyT]

I'd like to change my mind about n 3. The images I saw were from ebay listings so not reliable. I've now checked some books on rugmaking as well, which don't mention anything like this.
It looks like an ordinary dressmaker's bodkin at the tip - the sort of thing you use to thread elastic through a wasteband - but it's not just one of those pushed into a handle, there's a proper cross-pin making it look like a commercial tool which you could pull hard.
Rug making would be too slow if you needed to keep re-threading.