Drawing Out A Design For Bespoke Spindle Cutter?

[pollys13]

I bought some Wealden router cutters, Ovolo and Ogee to cut the profile moulds, for practicing my moulding carving. As shown by Chris Pye on his online school and his series of articles in Woodcarving Magazine 1999. In his articles I don't think he actually shows any of these scaled drawings, see attached.

I recently bought an alloy Whitehill Limiter block with a set of Ovolo moulding cutters and limiters .
These are for doing the moulding on my replacement front door.

I'd like to have a go at carving a larger scale, Egg & Dart moulding that Chris teaches in his projects.
So I need to get a larger size Ovolo cutter made up to produce the suitable sized profile for carving a large Egg & Dart moulding as shown in Mr Pyes door rail, see screenshot.

The companies that grind custom knife profiles for spindle moulders, preety much say, " " All we require is a scaled drawing / or a original timber sample. "

OK...... so how does one go about making up this.... scaled drawing? That would be suitable for what I'd like to do?
Cheers.

https://amymaytrust.com/

 

[Jacob]

Do a full sized drawing. Better to supply them with a sample as they can offer the cutter up to it for fine adjustments.

NB it's easy to make your own spindle cutters. They work out very cheap- cheaper than router cutters and you can have any pattern you like.

 

[katellwood]

If your block accepts euro cutters (6mm holes at 24mm centres) and i suspect it does, there is an abundance of different shapes available.

Some will cut a large quadrant or ovolo suitable for egg and dart

google euro cutter profiles.

alternatively purchase a pair of blanks, draw your profile on paper, copy it then glue them to the back of the blanks making sure they are in the same location on each cutter(for balance) and the grind line is not encompassed within the block, then simply grind to the line

http://www.axminster.co.uk/axcaliber-eu ... es-ax20803

 

[RobinBHM]

You need a 1:1 scale drawing which if scanned accurately can be emailed to the cutter grinding company.

They need the following information:

-type of cutter required

-cutter block make and spec

-cutter block rotation

Note that all cutter blanks have a profile area that can be machined. Euro cutters, the type with 2 pins at 24mm centres are available in 4mm, 5mm, 5.5mm thickness and in 40mm and 50mm widths.

Some blocks hide some of the profile area so cant be used for full depth shapes.
Some block wont take all cutter thcknesses.

Thicker cutters can have deeper profiles.

Also, the actual shape of the cutter is different from the shape of the mould it will cut. Always send a drawing of the timber profile you wznt to cut, the company will calculate the cutter development for you.

 

[custard]

Robin's nailed it, the only thing I'd add is to ask are sure you can't find a large ovolo off the shelf? I'm sure I've seen some whoppers in the knife catalogues.

 

[ColeyS1]

Robin's nailed it, the only thing I'd add is to ask are sure you can't find a large ovolo off the shelf? I'm sure I've seen some whoppers in the knife catalogues.

I was looking for an excuse to pop over the workshop :lol:

Any good ?

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

 

[pollys13]

Robin's nailed it, the only thing I'd add is to ask are sure you can't find a large ovolo off the shelf? I'm sure I've seen some whoppers in the knife catalogues.

I was looking for an excuse to pop over the workshop :lol:

Any good ?

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

Brill, Coley I think those would suit. I obviously wasn't looking in the right place on their site. Do they send out a paper catalogue on request?

 

[pollys13]

OK thanks everyone for the input.
Jacob, katellwood, in my wanderings around the internet. I have looked into grinding my own knife profiles. Think is also mentioned in the spindle moulder handbook. On the web, I got the impression, making not suited to diy . Requiring specialized small, but expensive grinding machine, and getting the knives properly balanced. The grinders similar to those ones used for sharpening your saw blades, spindle moulder and router cutters, further out of curiosity I looked at the various profile grinders, expensive, think several thousand and that was used.
You guys say is straightforward to make up your own cutters, any sources you could direct me to?
Cheers.

 

[pollys13]

If your block accepts euro cutters (6mm holes at 24mm centres) and i suspect it does, there is an abundance of different shapes available.

Some will cut a large quadrant or ovolo suitable for egg and dart

google euro cutter profiles.

alternatively purchase a pair of blanks, draw your profile on paper, copy it then glue them to the back of the blanks making sure they are in the same location on each cutter(for balance) and the grind line is not encompassed within the block, then simply grind to the line

http://www.axminster.co.uk/axcaliber-eu ... es-ax20803

google euro cutter profiles. I did look on Ebay, where they give a list, diagram of profiles with the cutter number but I could find only one or two, small Ovolo cutters.

 

[ColeyS1]

Yeah just ring them up. That's from the 2017 book, all conveniently printed to scale. I thought it was about time i got Whitehills latest catalogue cause I only had a 2009 one prior to this - only a bit out of date :lol:
Axminster were good for spindle cutters back in the day when they use to have a catalogue. Waste of time trying to find what you're after now on the website imho.

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

 

[Mike Jordan]

In past years it was common practice to grind your own cutters for one off jobs, this was easy to do when using the now illegal blocks which allowed you to move the attitude of the cutter in the block and present it to the workpiece at different angles. This was possible because the blocks had no retaining pegs to prevent ejection of cutters while in use. It was normal to settle for just one cutter cutting and the second providing just balance for the set up. The chances of anyone adjusting two cutters to the same cutting circle were very slim.
Now we are all using safety blocks with limiters you would need to grind a pair of cutters to within about 1 thou of the same profile in order to get both cutting, in addition the limiters must be a maximum of 1.6 mm smaller in order to comply with the rules.
I think its much better to make small alterations by grinding small alterations to the standard range of cutters to get the profile you need rather than starting from scratch. I have made cutters and limiters from scratch but it doesn't make commercial sense when you consider the time taken,particularly if you try to get both cutters cutting. I find it much easier to look at the paper catalogues of standard cutters rather than using many of the online ranges,they tend to only feature the profiles that sell well. The KWO catalogue is very good. Euro Cutter no 501 might give you what you want with a small alteration or two.

 

[pollys13]

In past years it was common practice to grind your own cutters for one off jobs, this was easy to do when using the now illegal blocks which allowed you to move the attitude of the cutter in the block and present it to the workpiece at different angles. This was possible because the blocks had no retaining pegs to prevent ejection of cutters while in use. It was normal to settle for just one cutter cutting and the second providing just balance for the set up. The chances of anyone adjusting two cutters to the same cutting circle were very slim.
Now we are all using safety blocks with limiters you would need to grind a pair of cutters to within about 1 thou of the same profile in order to get both cutting, in addition the limiters must be a maximum of 1.6 mm smaller in order to comply with the rules.
I think its much better to make small alterations by grinding small alterations to the standard range of cutters to get the profile you need rather than starting from scratch. I have made cutters and limiters from scratch but it doesn't make commercial sense when you consider the time taken,particularly if you try to get both cutters cutting. I find it much easier to look at the paper catalogues of standard cutters rather than using many of the online ranges,they tend to only feature the profiles that sell well. The KWO catalogue is very good. Euro Cutter no 501 might give you what you want with a small alteration or two.

I just looked at the KWO catalogue, under their spindle moulder knife section, they have 28 pages of diagrams of the various profiles I couldn't see a 501 I think they might be using a different part numbering system. I Googled euro cutter no 501 and found the profile. I'll request a paper version of their catalogue as well as the Whitehill one.
Cheers.

 

[Jacob]

.....Now we are all using safety blocks with limiters you would need to grind a pair of cutters to within about 1 thou of the same profile in order to get both cutting,

They still don't need both to cut as long as they aren't too far out i.e. off balance and causing vibration.
NB it's not actually illegal to use any old cutter. It might not be a good idea however and you could be liable for damages to others, or be prohibited by HSE - if you are working with other people. Working on your own and you wouldn't be breaking the law.
Spindle moulder is fairly safe if you have either power feed or use two push sticks and keep well away from cutters. And know what you are doing of course.

 

[G S Haydon]

I would not recommend grinding your own cutters and limiters (4 items) without a profile grinder. As mentioned, take a look at euro cutter sets, they are very good value. If you need specials, Whitehill offer great service. Speak with them about what you need to provide.

 

[pollys13]

.....Now we are all using safety blocks with limiters you would need to grind a pair of cutters to within about 1 thou of the same profile in order to get both cutting,

They still don't need both to cut as long as they aren't too far out i.e. off balance and causing vibration.
NB it's not actually illegal to use any old cutter. It might not be a good idea however and you could be liable for damages to others, or be prohibited by HSE - if you are working with other people. Working on your own and you wouldn't be breaking the law.
Spindle moulder is fairly safe if you have either power feed or use two push sticks and keep well away from cutters. And know what you are doing of course.

OK thanks, have a giant monster of a 1hp power feed and like to think I'm sensible. Will always ask forum if have any doubts about doing a procedure safely and properly.

 

[pollys13]

I would not recommend grinding your own cutters and limiters (4 items) without a profile grinder. As mentioned, take a look at euro cutter sets, they are very good value. If you need specials, Whitehill offer great service. Speak with them about what you need to provide.

OK cheers.